Could be wrong but I believe the 30-30 headspaces on the case rim, and the 35 Rem, on the case shoulder.

 

This is true, but how is it related to the pressure question?:hmmmm:

 

double post - oops

AC

 

It was designed for weaker actions would be my guess. If the .35 Rem. brass is as thin as other low pressure rounds than I would say no to upping pressures even in stronger actions. Great point to be brought up - I would like to hear more input on this subject. Rimmed, or rimless should make no difference as long as other factors are equal. Some of the highest pressure rounds are rimless , ie the .308 Winchester in at 60,000 psi per SAAMI spec.

AC

 

I believe gunscrewguy is correct about the 35 Rem being used in low pressure auto loaders and pumps. I will tell you that 35 Rem brass is IS thin...about 30% thinner than modern brass (308, 30-06, etc). Some folks will "pump up" 35 Rem loads, but brass life suffers eventually......head separation.....so, if you pump the 35 Rem up you would really need to keep a lookout for that issue!

One way to get around the thin brass issue and get big power from the 35 Rem is to use my SG 35 modification which will allow 3000+ ft lbs from the OEM cartridge. The second way to limit this issue is to make 35 Rem cases from modern 308 brass (forum member "Grumpa" offers 308 brass that has been modified to 35 Rem). Although the modified cases reduce the powder capacity by 2 grains, the 308-35 Rem cases are TOUGH!!!!

What I have done is used 308-35 Rem modified cases in my SG 35. Even with the reduced capacity of the modified cases I can still produce over 3000+ ft lbs with my SG 35 modified rifle....and that is a win/win situation for getting the most from the 35 Rem!

Another trick to case life longevity is annealing. Be it OEM 35 Rem or modified 308-35 Rem cases, annealing insures that the cases do not become brittle....which quickens the head separation process. By annealing even the OEM 35 Rem cases, you can lengthen their service life even when shooting high end loads.

 

Thanks for all of that good info, Flat Top. That 35 Rem. pic with the cast bullet is incredible! That will feed in a 336 action?! As far as case thickness, how thick is 30-30 brass? It never seemed all that thick to me and yet it's loaded to much higher pressure. But from searching on the net, it does seem that the 35 Rem. is kept mild because of the older Remington semi-autos still out there. I was reading several articles from some well known writers of popular gun magazines, and they worked up some hot loads in the 35 Rem., and even advocate making a +P marked 35 Remington. They mention the 336 and bolt guns as being able to handle the hotter pressures, but warn against use in the old semi-autos. So I guess that answers my question on why it's kept on the mild side (relatively speaking.)
That photo of the 35 Remington loaded with the cast bullet is impressive. What kind of penetration can you get with that? Looks like you could take some really big game with it.

 

some years ago, while looking through a reloading book ( old fart moment, forgot which) I found a section in the book with single shot pistol loads, the 35 Remington velocities were higher with heavier bullets than the 30/30 in the same length barrels. don't know why, except the large case mouth might let the gas out faster.

 

.35 Rem pressure




I found I needed to go 1 1/2 to 2 grains above the "maximum" load listed to get a good gas seal when firing my 336. No over pressure signs and accuracy was sub moa at 100 yards.

 

an interesting article on .35 Rem and 'hopping it up'....

One of my favorites is the .358 Winchester, and since I have..... 3 or 4? 35 Rem Marlins in the safe this was fun to read and think about.... 35 Ackley Improved.
Just read the article preview.... I didn't subscribe and am not suggesting you do. Too much $$ but the article start is interesting.

https://loaddata.com/Article/BenchTopics/Improving-the-35-Remington/107

 

I like things the way they are, I see no need at all to improve a perfect round. the way it is it will shoot through most any critter on the planet with the right boolit. I have been handloading 49 years, and the older I get the more relaxed me and my loads get. I go for accuracy not raw power or speed......

 

Yes, the 35 Rem was developed over 100 years ago in actions that were not built for +P loads, just like the 45 Colt was. Both can be loaded safely in actions that are built for stronger pressures. The Marlin action can safely handle more pressure than factory loads, how much, get some transducers to check the pressure in your action. OR, look up some +P 35 rem loads data and carefully work up loads for your rifle. All handloaders need to remember they are operating a high pressure containment system a few inches in front of their face, proceed with caution. DP

 

Yes, the 35 Rem was developed over 100 years ago in actions that were not built for +P loads, just like the 45 Colt was. Both can be loaded safely in actions that are built for stronger pressures. The Marlin action can safely handle more pressure than factory loads, how much, get some transducers to check the pressure in your action. OR, look up some +P 35 rem loads data and carefully work up loads for your rifle. All bandleaders need to remember they are operating a high pressure containment system a few inches in front of their face, proceed with caution. DP

My question wasn't asked with the intent of hot rodding the 35 Remington, but to understand why a cartridge developed in 1895 (the 30-30) was loaded to a much higher max pressure level than a cartridge developed in 1906 (the 35 Remington).

BTW, here is an interesting video of a guy shooting some original 1908 dated 35 Remington ammo through a Remington Model 8: Remington Model 8 Ammo Test « Forgotten Weapons
The stuff still went through steel plate!

 

I told you it would shoot through any critter including steel plate.roud: that is a nice video. I saw it a wile back, I am a member of the great8 forum. I really don't know why the pressure was different between the two. back then they made the model 8 auto and the pump 14 and 141 in 30 rem.(I have 3 of them) it is just a rimless 30-30 so the action of the model 8 model 14 and 141 could not have been the issue.

 

Well, whatever the reason, it's been getting the job done very nicely for 110 years. You can't argue with success!

 

Possibly because the 35 Rem was going to be first (?) chambered in the Remington Model 8 semi-auto rifle? No semi auto chamberings for the 30/30. Just a guess. Good question as I've been close to buying a couple of bolt action 35 Rems [XP100 pistol and old Model 600 rifle].

 

This darn computer spells worse than I do, changed handloader to bandleader.:vollkommenauf: When the 30-30 was first introduced, it wasn't as speedy as it is today. Had the 35 rem been as popular as the 45 colt, there would probably be more +P loads for it like the 45 colt. The work Flattop has done is awesome for the 35 rem. DP

 

I have been told there is no differance in thickness between the 30-30 and 35rem brass. I have been loading to the old 1960's velocity standards of 2160 fps for years ever since 35remington and ranchdog posted the +p 35rem loads. These are 10% lower than the 30-30win pressures and I get 2188 fps in my 366D with it short ported barrel. I still have IMR data for 2110 fps and Johan of western powders sent me +P 35 rem data for TAC which will get to 2250 fps in a 20" barrel 336. Again 35remington posted these frist. I know model #7 bolts load to 2300 fps with no pressure issues. Bolt & pump guns usually have 21" to 24" barrels too.

I looked at my ammo and it appears I have shot about 400 rounds of these +P loads to date over about ten years.