Some fine eating for sure!

 

You did great!

 

congrats !!!

that's very cool!!!

only thing I don't understand is the legislation... makes no sense to me what that means... what is it they are actually trying to limit or promote with that rule?

very interesting to see what you did though. Great!!!

 

I have no clue! Off the cuff I would chock it up to ignorance in our state government law making body. That or some senator wanted to see what kind of crazy wildcats could be dreamed up!

 

Good job! Nice that your project worked out so well. What did you name your new round?

 

I have not named this round but some guys over in the INgo (ingunowners.com) have named it the 45-70 Libertarian since it is a 45-70 government with less government. I think it is a brilliant name!

 

Nice big doe..cool gun..Way to go..............

 

Hi Djones. Interesting project. I have a question.
What do you call the caliber?
Thanks, Packard

 

Pretty cool...is it a 45-70 short short or a 45-60 short???
Nice to see you got it working.

 

great pics and very interesting new round hope it continues to work so well

 

I have a question for all you Hoosiers out there...does the IN state law require that the chamber of the firearm and the cartridge being shot in the firearm be the same, or does the law only require the "cartridge" to be of legal length? Thanks! FT

 

I would be curious about that too.

Congratulations, :congrats: that's pretty innovative! I'll bet I'm not the only one who would like to hear more of the ballistics of your cartrige. Anything you'd care to share would be interesting to me.

Another that would qualify would be the .50-70, it's case is 1.750 long. It'd be interesting to see if it would be too large a diameter or have too big a rim to work in a Marlin
Frank

 

That is great! Nice deer too

 

Congrats on a great hunt.

 

I want to share my experiences with you all. I am new to reloading so I had a lot of fun with this project. Please use caution as I have altered the case length of a standard cartridge. I did use published data from accurate's website.

I shortened brass roughly to 1.85 with a Dremel and cutoff wheel. Then took it down to 1.795-1.8" with a lee case trimmer for a 460 S&W. Full length resized with lee die. I did not use the expander die. Charged cases and seated bullet.
Crimping done with a 0.3" shortened lee factory crimp die.

Uncrimped with std 45-70 for reference:

Crimped!:

I have a Marlin GBL 45-70 with an 18.5" barrel. I am using Starline 1.8" cases. 30 grains of 5744 powder. Rem LRP. Cast bullet 450 grain round flat nose. OAL is 2.54. Heavy crimp. Velocity 1350-1380 fps.

Recoil is mild compared to my rifled 12 gauge auto slug gun. I was also able to hold a tighter group with the Marlin iron sight at 50 yards compared to my scoped gun!

I hope to be able to slip into the woods soon.

If anyone wants detail on any part of the process. I would be willing to help out.

Edit 12-1-2012

Stand hunting overlooking a 5 acre quail unlimited CRP field. Watched 4 does for about half hour. I waited until the largest gave me an easy shot.
Success. 40 yard shot. One shot ran about 10 yards. Complete pass through no noticeable expansion. After skinning there was no noticeable meat damage.

 

Congrats on the successful hunt.
Who says a slow moving chunk of lead wont work.
Perhaps a 45-55 caliber?

 

DjonesThanks for the information. That's a nice looking bullet & I'll bet with the shortened case you won't run into any feeding/extraction issues.You still have the ability to shoot full size .45-70s. I am guessing the law only applies to hunting??? If that's the case you can load say 50 of the shorter cases, a very good supply for hunting, & full length .45-70 loaded to the same velocity as your .45-70 Libertarian for range practice & fun stuff? That velocity range is a light load for the Marlin in full length brass & very easy to get without any pressure. Seems like it'd be a easy thing for practice.
Again congratulatioins.
Frank

 

Thanks Frank. The law only applies to deer hunting. I have a 405 grain load that is my favorite. It moves along at 1500-1550. I like it the best. Will use it for elk someday hopefully!

 

Nice project and a very nice doe. Great for the grill.

 

Thanks for sharing. Great post!!! And... nice doe. :biggrin:

 

Are you sure the law doesn't state a case length of a minimum of 1.8"? That's usually the way most state laws read with regard to hunting calibers.

Steve

 

From IN DNR handbook:


Rifles with cartridges that fire a bullet of .357-inch diameter or larger; have a minimum case length of 1.16 inches; and have a maximum case length of 1.8 inches are legal to use only during the deer firearms and special antlerless seasons. Some cartridges legal for deer hunting include the .357 Magnum, .38-.40 Winchester, .41 Magnum, .41 Special, .44 Magnum, .44 Special, .44-.40 Winchester, .45 Colt, .454 Casull, .458 SOCOM, .475 Linebaugh, .480 Ruger, .50 Action Express, .500 S&W, .460 Smith & Wesson, .450 Bushmaster, and .50 Beowulf.

 

The way I read that law, it sounds like the rifle must be "chambered for the cartridge it is firing"....am I wrong?

 

Plenty of 35 Remington 336s in the woods. Trimmed from ~1.9" to 1.8". I didn't have a 35 rem or I would do that.

38 special will chamber in a legal 357 gun where 38 are illegal but 357 are not

In my interpretation the law applies to the ammo not the gun.

Like the 357/38 example my 45-70 can fire legal and illegal ammo. I wanted to take my 405 standard length ammo with me in case I saw a coyote or bobcat but I didn't want to be caught hunting with ammo that does not qualify for deer hunting.

It would be hard for COs to gauge the bore of a rifle but they could quickly measure spent cases to harvest a deer or measure ammo on your person.

 

djones

I am impressed that was a lot of great thinking taking what you had and creating what what you needed that is a very interesting cartridge and some great pics thank you for sharing with us what you did..

 

....would be interesting how the folks who enforce the law interpret it. I like the idea that you can do what you are doing...and I had a request to do the same and test such in my 444. I asked on another post about the law and its enforcement and never got an answer. I guess my point is: If you are stopped, is the enforcement officer going to look at the rifle (a 45-70) and judge the legality in reference to law against it being a 45-70, or, will he judge legality against the cartridge the rifle is firing? I am just glad that in our state we dont have the nonsense you have to put up with.

 

it is reference to the shell case length which you are carrying and using

 

Excellent.
Congratulations on the doe and your shortened 45-70.

JD338

 

Congrats. I love a story with a happy ending. I switched to 450 marlin cut to 1.8" this year, but I did kill 4 with a 45-70 cut to 1.625" All were one shot kills. The longest runner was about 50 yds shot through the heart.

 

I think Flat Top's question is pretty interesting. It does seem like tons of people in IN do similar things, but the law is pretty funny in the way it is worded. It is clear that they intend that people use "pistol" cartridges out of rifles but they seem to allow rifle cartridges out of handguns?!

In most cases they seem to be referring specifically to the cartridge being fired, but there is that one line that says "Rifles must fire a cartridge..." My guess would be that if anyone did stop you for doing this, a judge would have to throw it out as the law is vague at best.

 

It doesn't sound vague to me. It's one sentence. ...rifles with LEGAL CARTRIDGES....are legal during the firearms seasons.

 

I am just wondering if anybody has actually called the game commission in Indiana and asked if or how the law is to be enforced. I asked the same question in another post and evidently no body had the want to ask the authorities. I am not saying its right or wrong, I am just looking for an answer. If they allow it thats definitely a good thing, and allows for some experimentation and testing. If they dont allow it and the authorities start citing folks for doing it...you know what they are going to say.....ignorance is no excuse.

I like wildcatting and developing cartridges, etc....if the laws get any crazier in Indiana you all may be using one of my older designs (photo attached) I call it the 444 Short...this can also be done with the 45-70 and the 450M so, there is hope if the restrictions over there tighten up :biggrin: