Some rifles, as are some calibers, are better brush busters than others.

Same holds true that some brush can be busted, some cannot.

I think it all depends on the good common sense of the responsible hunter and him knowing the limitations of both his stick, the pill he choose to feed it, and his skill.

I've never had a small twig deflect a shot from any of my rifles - but a small twig can completely change the path of an arrow or bolt.

Conversely, I've seen a branch cause a rifle shot to go completely astray.

 

Once read an article (Fur,Fin,& Feather Magazine?) the guy tested a bunch of calibers shooting at targets through brush. He admitted there was no way to duplicate results between calibers etc but did quite a abit of shooting and his guess/theory from his testing was, guns with moderate velocity but a fast rate of rifleing twist seemed to deflect less. Figured the bullets started out more stable would tend to stay more stable after hitting something.

 

The only time I have ever tried to 'buck the brush' was when the critters were standing immediately behind or very close to the offending branch or trunk.

I took a nice 4x4 whitetail several years ago that would not present a shot to the vitals. I center-punched through a 1-1/2" dia. jack pine that was about 18" or so from that deer. The deer was broadside to me at about 50 yards. The bullet passed the jack pine easily enough and struck true... If that deer would have been a few feet or more from that jack pine, I never would have taken that shot. I was shooting a .30-06 loaded with a 150 grain Speer Mag-Tip loaded to 2,900 fps - - it was a complete pass-through. That deer made it about 20 feet after the shot.

Four years ago, I took a dry whitetail doe under pretty similar circumstances with my .44 Mag loaded with an NEI #252 240 gr. SWC-GC loaded to 1,750 fps. With that shot, the bullet went through about 3" of a pine tree trunk that I think she was rubbing against. Anyhow, she dropped exactly where she stood, and that bullet was a pass-through as well.

Like I said, if those critters had been further from those trees, I wouldn't have attempted those shots. The potential for greater deflection over any sort of increased distance would have made those shots irresponsible, at best. If I had any doubts about the rifles or loads I was shooting, I wouldn't have tried those shots either. If I had been shooting a lighter caliber or a lighter bullet or a hyper-velocity type round, I would probably have passed on those shots as well.

I don't think it is so much about which cartridge or bullet is better at 'bucking the brush' so much as it is how close is the brush to the target, and so long as the cartridge, the bullet, and the load are fully capable of the task at hand.

 

12 gauge sst slugs ricochet of some small limbs that you would think you could shoot arrows through.

 

Some high speed rounds may be subject to more deflection, if we follow that line of thought, the ultimate brush gun for deer would be a 12GA slug gun. I think common sense of the part of the hunter is more the issue, only take a shot your confident of making.

Dirty Harry said it......."a man ought to know his limitations"

 

I will say this ,a fast bullet from a 30-06 or 308 or 270 25-06 in the likes will not work in thick brush A slow bullet from these will work .That why the ols 30-30 32an 35 an 45-70 work well for these shots

 

Ihave also shot some deer in some thicketts over the years with the 30/30 and 35 and recovery never seemed to be a problem most of my shots were at about 30 to 40 yards wich is preety close with that being said i think theys calibers are great for short range in the brush. just my 2 cents .

 

Back in 1999, I shot a doe standing in a tangle of brush with the .35. I aimed for the shoulder, it made it there and dropped it.

 

I shot a nine point buck last month at around 20 yards through an opening that was probably less then a foot in diameter with my 336 in 30-30 . I looked through that tangle and saw all sorts of twigs that I hadn't orignally seen and thought I had missed the deer, but when I recovered him, I had hit him exactly where I aimed.

 

Everyone has their opinion.Years ago Jack O`Conner did a field test and found the 243 to deflect the least.Go figure!!!:hmmmm:

 

In my experience, I've never had a deflection even with 243win. It really depends on what the dang brush is made of. Osage Orange and Hickory are two that I believe have the potential to deflect. I too have shot through a tree with 30-06 on purpose. I was in a climbing tree stand and spotted a buck about 85 yards away lying down. I knew I had only one chance, I slipped a FMJ in and it went through a pine about seven inches across and hit him in the shoulder, he exploded and I found him fifty yards down hill.

 

Here in Upstate NY, the old Adirondack hunters used to sing the praises of the 35 Rem. as a good brush gun. A heavy, slow bullet. If you think about a ping ball and a baseball hitting a small limb, which would deflect more easily. Maybe not a perfect comparison, but ..............

 

Here's an article concerning some tests conducted fifty years ago to find some answers to the "brush bucking" controversy. Even though a half a century has passed, the results is still valid today.

About Brush Busters - Guns June 1962

PB

 

Too many variables in this equation to have any valid rules. I try to have the clearest line of flight for any bullet that is possible.

 

I hit a cabbage palm branch by accident while trying to shoot a doe with a30/30 and 170 grain core lokts . Every ridge on the palm branch had a higher and higher hole from the bullet. In 18 inches of holes through branch, bullet climbed 3 to 4 inches. The only way I would ever shoot through any small obstruction is if it was touching the animal I was atemping to shoot .

 

I'm not sure it's as simple as saying one cuts through brush any better than another; there's a lot going on. Projectile shape would seem to me to be a big factor also.

But in terms of science, I think momentum has a lot to do with it. I believe a bullet with higher momentum will cut through brush better. Momentum is the ability to resist change in direction after all.

 

I just anything is possible on any given day

 

Powder Monkey; Cant thank you enough for linking that old issue of Guns....boy does that bring back memories!!!!!

In the "brush busting article" the author makes a point and shows proof that brush busting with just about any bullet can cause the bullet to upset and keyhole on the target, Trying to shoot at game through brush or thick cover is iffy at best.... as are the results. My favorite hunting spots are very thick...matter of fact, I make it a point to get into the thick of it because thats were the deer are where I hunt. My rule for deer hunting is: "If the area is so thick that I dont even want to attempt to get in there....thats were I need to be." I have hunted the thick stuff with everything from 22 centerfires to big bores, and to my knowledge have never had an issue....and I know for a fact that some of those bullets have hit obstructions on the way to the target. I just try to take the cleanest shot possible. John Taylor segregated rifles into two groups. One group or group of cartridges he considered good for open field shooting....small and medium bores. The other group was considered suitable for "all conditions" including dense thick cover. For the most part, he considered the 375 H&H the "minimum" standard for "all conditions", so, he favored large medium and large bores for that task. I would think that a streamlined small or medium bore bullet would have more of a propensity to upset than a large heavy slow moving bullet with a flat meplat, but I have no way of proving that. When I hunt the thick stuff, I prefer a big bore with a heavy bullet and if I hunt open big woods or field edges, etc, where the shots would be longer, and be less likely to encounter obstructions I would choose a flat shooting a medium bore. I like to think that Taylor had it right, but who is to know? The best advice is to take the cleanest shot that you can and hope for the best.

 

Shots taken through"heavy undergrowth", your choice of words, is a crap shoot. You never know when a tree or something else might pop up at exact moment you fire. Some time you just have to pass on the shot. Taking one under advise conditions is risky at best.

"brush cut down by the bullets path.................." Your words. My vision of your statement is like a mini hurricane just passed through the area.

Your first paragraph tells the tail. Your on the money there.

I`m sure you`ve taken your fair share of deer, as you`ve stated but I`m not in lock step with your selection of shots.
Different strokes for different folks.

 

The cut down brush I was referring to was a few pieces <1 inch in diameter. If it cut down brush like a hurricane that would be even better! I should of stated that I have Passed up numerous shots on deer because I could not get a clear enough shot, I don't just shoot at blind spots of brush.

 

Since I switched to a Phaser I no longer have problems with brush!:driver:

 

If I have a clear shot at the kill zone I let it fly. I never tested my 30-30 or .35 by shooting at the body of a Deer that is obstructed by brush... Which is why I was a bit peeved at the marleting of the day when big bore rounds were touted as brush busters (as they seem to encourage unethical shooting practices). That said, shoot only through a clear lane so you won't have worry about deflections. If you can clearly see your game you can clearly shoot your game.

 

It's a pretty easy answer if you think about it from an "intuitive" physics aspect.
Say my 44 magnum with a 265 grain pill going at 1,600 fps - it has 1,500 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle and almost 1,000 at 100 yds.
Now think of that in terms of real mass and ask yourself how much a twig is going to deflect 1,000 lbs. For anything to deflect a bullet haulin' booty it would have to have a mass representing a significant percent of the effective mass that boolit is packing plus it's modulus of elasticity would have to be high enough that it would resist deformation (fancy way of saying it'd have to be hard and stiff . We tend to think of boolits as "small" but they are really concentrated energy.

 

PA Brushbuster71, from that picture I'd say you have about the perfect CQH rifle. I bet is't easy to get through the brush with that rifle. More pictures of that rifle and info on how you made it would be nice, someone else on here is about to do the same to a Glenny as you did to yours. Take care, John.

 

PA Brushbuster71, from that picture I'd say you have about the perfect CQH rifle. I bet is't easy to get through the brush with that rifle. More pictures of that rifle and info on how you made it would be nice, someone else on here is about to do the same to a Glenny as you did to yours. Take care, John.[/QUOTE

Thanks, this was my first rifle given to me by a relative through marriage when I was 12. In 2001 this rifle this took the biggest buck I have ever taken. Five years ago I decided to make this a bit more handy, had the stock cut to 12.5inches and the barrel to 17 inches. I'm a not the tallest guy so the gun fits my arm length perfectly. Just put the Leupold vx3 on it, very clear, money well spent. I had federal 170gr power shok ammo laying around, so I used it to sight the gun in with. It's so accurate, 5 bullets touching at 50 yards I decided not to try anything else and have been using them successfully for years now. Like I said before shouldering it feels like an extention of my body, and the utility of it almost boring. They are going to have to bury me with this gun.