Out of those 4198 or tac would be my choice. But H322 is my goto

 

I use H4895 in my BLR 358 Win. but IMR4895 is suggested in Speer #13 manual for the 180 gr. FN. and Win. 748 with Large Magnum primers.
Rifle used was a Savage 358w. 99

 

The original Winchester factory recommended loads were 748 with the WLR primer (a mag primer for standard ball powder loads), 200 gr bullet 50.6 grs 748 2500 fps, 250 gr bullet 46.2 grs 748 2,250 fps. Winchester loading manual #14.

From a velocity perspective 748 is ideal with 220 gr bullets. TAC and 4895 are going to out perform for velocity with the lighter 180 gr bullets. 748 or 335 is the powder used here with the 180 gr Speer. Did a lot of 748 in 356/358, and like the 335 load, both are loaded down to 2400 fps, due to known to me, bullet integrity issues at close range. 748 had not trouble meeting that velocity, and gave superior accuracy.

All the later 99s from 1953 when adapted to the 243/308/358 feature actions designed to handle the higher pressures of these more modern rounds 60,000 psi or 52,000 cup. While not discussed, the 300 Sav (42,000 cup) can be up loaded a fair amount, in this later action. Different from a BLR, Win 88 there is no primary rotary extraction, which can lead to somewhat sticky extraction when fully loaded, thou the loads themselves are perfectly safe. For this reason, I tend to load my 99s at least 100 fps below a max recommended load.

 

My .358 is a BLR . I shoot the 180 Speer pushed by 43 grains of H4198. Not sure how much if any difference in the IMR compared to the Hodgdon version. The load I use gets just over 2700 fps in my gun, that's really too fast for that bullet but it is the most accurate load in that gun . At shorter distances the bullet comes apart at that speed , 2500-2600 would be better if your rifle shoots it at that speed. Mine will but the group size grows some.

 

Generally speaking my big game woods hunting loads are not the fastest nor most accurate load out of any given rifle. Preferring to load a proven soft big game bullets at more moderate velocities for woods to moderate range work. Having carried the 180 gr Speer at 2400 fps a lot during my game control career, good out thru 250 yards, 2 inches or better at 100 yards, is good enough practical accuracy.

 

Any particular reason why you choose Speer 180 gr. FN to shoot out of a Savage 99 358 W.?
Come to think of it, I bought 5 boxes when they were cheap and already had an open box. My BLR and the Win. 94AE-356 W. shoot Spr. 180gr. FN not too well. But the first time out with HDY. 200 gr. FTX. It was another story

 

I shoot the 200 gr Hornady Interlock SP with a near max load of IMR-4895 in my Savage Mod 99C 358 Win. I get great accuracy and that load works wonders on the local deer. It also will handle any unfriendly black bear who wander into my hunting area.

 

I'm a newcomer to the 180gr Speer, but not the .358 which I've used for about 35 years. I'd read lots of good reports on the bullet, both here and at Midway USA. I used it this past season out of my BLR/.358 at a claimed 2600 FPS on a pretty nice Kentucky buck. He was DRT at about 50 yards. Full penetration with no undo internal damage.

 

IME the Speer 180, like most HotCore bullets, doesn’t expand to a large dismeter but holds together and penetrates well. Below is a photo of one found under the hide in a caribou.

 

I think this is perfect expansion. Looks just like a Nosler Partition minus the petals. Perfect balance to get internal damage and huge penetration.

 

Why 180s?
This is my whitetail gun.
I currently have a 200 grn Hornady rnd nose load with IMR 4064, that shoots 2" at 100yds off sand bags.
I think this gun can shoot better.
The 180s were not available until this summer.
Gonna see if 180s group better.
225 grain bullets are next, but they tend to be built a bit more for Whelen speeds.
So, 180s first.


Thanks to all

 

I have had good luck with 225 gr Sierras and Ramshot Tac. 2445 fps and 1.25 MOA out of a 20 inch tube.

 

Dusty Have you shot deer with the Sierra 225 and if so how did they perform ? I have read that most 225 grn 358 rifle bullets are built a tad tough for deer sized game. Thank you

 

I have shot 6 or so deer, and a bear with the 225 gr Sierra. Those were all out of a 358 Norma Magnum with a muzzle velocity of 2850 fps. All the deer minus 1 was dead before it hit the ground. I never recovered a bullet.

The bear took two rounds from the Norma. One went though its vitals and snapped the arm on the other side. The second shot went in by the ribs and stopped by the hip. The bear was probably around 250 lbs, maybe a little less. The bear traveled about 60 to 80 yards before it lost enough blood and fell over. I finished it off with a handgun.

The Sierra has gotten the job done for me. I don't know if the extra velocity helped. Reading up on the bullet a lot of people say it under performs on bigger game as it like to fragment. I have never seen it happen.

 

The 180 is the most accurate bullet in my BLR when I push it to the 2700 fps speed. I and my dad both tried all of the other weights and bullet types in it and all shoot well enough but not like the 180 Speer pushed a max speed . The only thing about pushing it that fast is that at 100 yards and less where I shoot most of my deer it acts like an oversized Vmax . It is very explosive. Past 150-200 yards maybe not so much but I haven't shot one at that distance to know. Never seen one that I shot that looked like the bullet recovered from Rollingblock's Caribou in all of the few bullets I have recovered. The last deer I shot with my load was at roughly 80 yards. He was standing on a very slight slope with his rump slightly higher than his chest. I shot high in the chest from a slight left angle. The bullet tore up both lungs and damaged the heart and liver then exited on the right side taking out a chunk of three ribs. You could have dropped the magazine from the BLR in the exit hole without touching the sides of the hole. There was much lung tissue hanging on the bushes and on the ground. I found the jacket next to a sapling about the size of my wrist and the largest bullet chunk was imbedded in the sapling about half way through. It weighed 27 grains. The jacket was expanded to the point of being flat. It does kill deer but at that speed it is destructive beyond anything needed to kill deer. Better shot in the 2500-2600 range unless your shots are mostly gonna be 200 yards or over.

 

Both my BLR and SS Hawkeye 358s shot the Sierra 225gr very well. I do not recall shooting a deer with one, but did take an average Maine black bear in 2015 with it. The bear dropped in it's tracks.

 

Both my BLR and SS Hawkeye 358s shot the Sierra 225gr very well. I do not recall shooting a deer with one, but did take an average Maine black bear in 2015 with it. The bear dropped in it's tracks.

View attachment 940823

Yes, I shoot Sierra 225 GameKing. in my BLR 81 358W. and after the last time at the range with the Win.94AE 356W. my go to bullet is HDY's .358" 200gr. FTX. the best accurate load ever.

 

I have 5 sealed boxes and one open of Speer .358" 180gr. FN bullets and I figure I use them in two 336 35R. i have at MV. of 2,302 with LVR powder as printed online Hodgdon data. At this MV. and bullet weight it closely matches the 300 Savage. But would be better than a 300 Savage in a woodland hunting situation. JMO.

 

Thanks for all the input, looks like I may need to buy more bullets to try?
🤪

Does anyone have any load data with Tac and the 180s and 200rn ?
Tac is a faster burn rate than Imr 4064 and 4895 but slower than Imr 4198.
Thanks again

 

Thanks for all the input, looks like I may need to buy more bullets to try?
🤪

Does anyone have any load data with Tac and the 180s and 200rn ?
Tac is a faster burn rate than Imr 4064 and 4895 but slower than Imr 4198.
Th

 

Not in .358” 180gr. But in .200gr. Hornady has tac powder with a 200gr. bullet at Max Muzzle Velocity 2700fps. In HDY #11 manual. Data can be adopted for other 200gr. Pill

 

In my Savage Mod 99C 358 Win, I use a near maximum load of IMR-4895 to fire the 200 grain Hornady Interlock SP. My big game hunting loads for the woods are often not the quickest or most accurate loads for any given weapon.

 

Just my two cents, but it sounds like the Speer 180 is too hard for use at the lower velocities, but at 35 Rem speeds I got absolutely amazing accuracy with it, and others I shot with had similar results. But as was said, 2 inches at 100 yards is all you need, there are darn few benchrests in the hunting grounds, and field accuracy is a whole 'nuther matter. I water-tested the Speer 180 twenty years ago, got good (not great) expansion, but bear in mind the recovered bullet diameter isn't always the best indicator, those folded-back petals were perpendicular as the bullet passed through flesh.

Oh, and BTW.....we overthink this whole process. Put a decent bullet in the boiler room and get out the skinning knife!

 

This is true, I guess everybody is looking for that silver bullet.
Well, I have 5+ boxes of Speer's .358" 180gr. FN. I don't hunt much anymore. I own rifles meant for hunting, and I load for it too. But there isn't anything that put a smile on my face when my shots are in the X ring. IMO if you don't have confidence in yourself and the rifle you take a field, why bother going.
Once again, I guess a good round in a rifle that you know will hit where it should, and all that's left is patience and skill.

 

Older thread…I know. I’ve shot a few deer with the .358, 180 grain hot core out of a 35 Rem at 2300 fps. One a super low broadside bottom of the heart shot placement that ran 60 plus yards, one a far back liver shot that ran 40 yards in a circle, and a quartering away going up hill around a 130 yards. Entered just in front of the last rib and out the neck. Deer took a step or two and fell over dead. All left fifty cent sized entry and exit holes in hides.

I loaded some up to try in my 35 Whelen with a starting load of h4895. According to quick load data it’s around 2634 ft./s with my short barrel and loaded a little bit shorter OAL than what book listed. I’m hoping it opens up a little little bit better to knock deer off their feet since I hunt close to my property line and I would lose a deer to my neighbors. I’ll take loosing in a little meat since I have a half dozen extra tags each year automatically comes with my deer licenses. I don’t end up shooting that many but I normally take an extra one or two for meat.

My short barreled little 35 whelen 7600 carbine likes that little .358 180 grain Speer hot core. I am probably close to max 358 Winchester velocities if I had to guess with the starting load in my short barreled Whelen. I didn't even have to ladder test it. It was a random starting load I tried just to zero my scope in. Even a blind pig finds an acorn every once in a while apparently! Here’s the first three shot hundred yard group with the random load. I loaded up six and checked my zero at 25 and then worked to 100 with the next three. The last two shot in same hole an inch above the bull’s-eye after I adjusted it over a couple clicks after I shot the group below. I’m sure it will knock a deer on its butt And another 350 ft./s faster versus 35 Rem load. Is tough as a bullet is this little thing is I’m sure the extra velocity will help with dropping it in Its tracks

A .4”, 100 yard group out of Remington 35 whelen 7600 carbine with 180 grain, Speer .358 hot cores with 56 grains of H4895 at 3.030”.

Here is the print out from load data below. The exact same 56 grain charge data loaded 10,000th longer according to Hodgens website says it’s 2650 fps with a 24” barrel. So I would guess would be around 2500 fps at 3.040” with my short 18.5” barrel. I was shocked with a 134 fps jump with 10,000th less OAL. I was figuring only a 25 to 40 fps gain with the shorter OAL. I’ll have run the load across my chronograph. I’ve read through this post and see a lot of inflated numbers that I don’t think or anywhere near what they’re shooting and probably went by book numbers and I’m just as guilty as charged. I used to go offload book data velocities all the time in boy is there a rude awakening when you run it across the chronograph and it’s not even close to the numbers, you thought it was published in the book. I think that’s because a lot of guys load closer to the lands and don’t realize how much velocity they gave up doing it.

 

The Speer .358 180 gr is an outstanding mid range deer bullet, IMO the pick of the .358/35 Rem litter. Striking velocities around 2300 fps and above, can result in the bullet loosing its core. As stated earlier expect large exit wounds. If it is driven to max 358 Win velocities, around 2700 fps, it makes a decent mid range deer load, but the bullet will be prone to break up on close range shots, that is my experience.

 

My shots are normally 15 to 80 yards normally 20 to 45 yards are common. I would assume I’ll have a nice big exit hole and deer slamming to the ground At 2634 fps MV.