[94/44]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

Thompson Center used to claim of their 30-30s in handgun. More energy at 100yds than the .44 has at the muzzle. Go figure. All the paper ballistics in the world does no good at all in the field with one well placed shot.

Was that factory or reload ad data?

 

[rripper]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I have never ever shot any living thing with a centerfire rifle of any caliber, that hasn't died in a most expedient manner.

 

[94/44]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

And I have never ever seen any living thing shot with a rifle of any caliber, that hasn't died in a most expedient manner due to proper shot placement.

 

[jackruff]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

SilverBow, a fellow traditional bowhunter and Marlin enthusiast, has said it really well. The killing ability of a bullet or an arrowhead (power isn't the best word here) depends totally on the physiologic damage done to an animal's vital organs and systems. If a broadhead, which depends entirely on causing bleeding, shot by a 40 lb pull bow can kill a deer within 30 to 40 yards from the point of implact - and it can! - then any of a 44 mag, 30-30, 357, 45, or a whole host of other calibers can certainly do the same thing. The whole issue, in my opinion, is what can the individual hunter use best to get the bullet in the animal's vitals? And at what range? What limitations is the hunter willing to place on himself? What does he most enjoy carrying around and shooting? I have a strong, healthy young friend who shoots whitetails with a 300 magnum, but good grief, who wants to inflict such punishment on himself? He seems to, but I don't understand why. Another friend gave up his 300 a while back because it was too heavy to carry. He now uses a 44 magnum revolver, a 270, or a 30-30 lever action depending on what he wants to carry on a given day.
The words energy and momentum have simple definitions and both depend on both bullet mass and velocity. If you know the value of either of them you can calculate the other provided you know either the mass or the velocity of the bullet. Energy, in joules, is one-half the mass, in kilograms, of the bullet times the square of the velocity, in meters per second. Momentum, measured in kilogram-meters per second,using the same units as above for mass and velocity, is simply mass times velocity. There are English units for all of these quantities, but they are more complicated to use than international (or metric) units. Power, perhaps the most often mis-used term used to identify a physical property in the English language, is the rate at which energy is delivered or converted. It really has no application in this discussion. I hope the physics lesson neither offends nor intimidates anyone, because I have no intent to do either, but when you're talking about physics (the basic rules of nature), clear communication is helped by the accurate use of its terms.

 

[momentum]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

It's really all about range, if you shoot stuff under 125 yards, I'd go with the 44 mag, If I was hunting at around 200 yards, I'd bring out the 30-30.

 

[94/44]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

At 200yds. most 30-30 factory 170grn. loads drop to sub-sonic,.... less than a 1,000 FPS. Not what I would like to hit a large beastee with. ;D

With that being said.

I should mention a incident related to me many years ago,... where a Alaskan Inuit woman killed a world class polar bear with one 22lr shot to its eye. Its tear duct, to be more exact,.... if memory serves me. I believe it was stuffed and now resides in a Nevada casino lobby.

My point?

Shot placement is really all that counts in the real world,......for me.

 

[janott]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

kmittleman, what did ya decide? 44, 30-30 or 444....... lots of ideas out there. Thank God we live in America where we have choices. ;D ;D ;D

Joe

 

[Mannlicher]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I hunt deer with both cartridges. I'll be honest, I see no difference in their ability to kill Florida deer.

I have not lost an animal yet, and have had about the same amount of DRT animals with both, and about the same number of animals that ran 100 yards or less.

My personal favorite is the .44 Mag though.

 

[momentum]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I hunt deer with both cartridges. I'll be honest, I see no difference in their ability to kill Florida deer.

I have not lost an animal yet, and have had about the same amount of DRT animals with both, and about the same number of animals that ran 100 yards or less.

My personal favorite is the .44 Mag though.

Doesn't surprise me at all, I think these two calibers are very close in killing power, they just do it differently, one is a bit more versatile with more bullet weights and probably more applications (44 magnum) and one is more straight forward just a hunting caliber. One has a ballistic advantage at longer distances (the 30-30), the other hits a bit harder when loaded right up close (44 magnum) but when all is said and done, and you have a normal load for both calibers and you shoot that deer 83 yards away, there isn't any difference, the result is the same. IMO it's really much more a question of the gun they come in, how much you value a bigger capacity in the mag, if you want to use it for something else etc... but strictly shooting dear at close ranges, flip a coin.

 

[davidl]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

If I was deer hunting, I wouldnt use either, I would use something a lot more efficient, a 30-06 etc for instance. I do not want to wound anything and have it run off. With more power and range you are much more prepared.

 

[94/44]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

If I was deer hunting, I wouldnt use either, I would use something a lot more efficient, a 30-06 etc for instance. I do not want to wound anything and have it run off. With more power and range you are much more prepared.

Davidl,

Thank you!!!! Makes sense to me!

I know there are many gun folk that feel they have to have as many pieces in as many calibers as their heart desires, causing all kinds of caliber decisions to be contemplated... I know, I was one of them once. I will leave that thought as is, since it would be leaning off the OP's topic.

Back on topic,... I strongly believe in acquiring and becoming efficient with the largest, most powerful caliber/weapon, one feels comfortable with. When killing something, there is (in my opinion) no such thing as too much power. Of course there are situation which calls for some tweaking in this concept, such as where small game/camp food or birds are taken. But I am going off topic again. ;D

For example,... since acquiring a 444 my 44mag has suddenly taken second seat relegated to a house defense, corner sitting piece. There is nothing I would want to do with 44mag, that a 444 will not do better when in the back country, so why carry something less. If the 30-30 or the 44mag is your satisfactory power level, then more than likely you will accomplish anything you attempt, with either one. There is a very old saying,... "beware the one gun man". Or, in other words, pick one, use it, be as good as you can be with it. I believe that adage is still relevant today.

94/44

 

[momentum]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

If I was deer hunting, I wouldnt use either, I would use something a lot more efficient, a 30-06 etc for instance. I do not want to wound anything and have it run off. With more power and range you are much more prepared.

Sure 30-06 is a great caliber, everyone knows that, but you can adapt and use different guns for different situations. If we're talking hunting deer at under 200 yards range either 30-30 and 1894 in 44 magnum will kill the deer as dead as it can get and will be very effective, so will a 30-06 too of course but it has power and ability not used or needed in this scenario for this task. You could use a .50 caliber Browning machine gun too and it would work fine but again, not needed for this task. Everyone should probably just use whatever they are most comfortable with and a gun they shoot really well so they can hit the deer where it counts, regardless of gun or caliber.

 

[Snew]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

If I was deer hunting, I wouldnt use either, I would use something a lot more efficient, a 30-06 etc for instance. I do not want to wound anything and have it run off. With more power and range you are much more prepared.

I honestly don't think efficient was the right word to use here. Where I hunt in Western Oregon the 30-06 would offer no more benefit over the other 2 calibers and may even be detrimental if it's much longer or heavier.

 

[skwang]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

"killing power" comes from a bullet going through the hide, bone, and soft tissue with enough energy to damage something important. Shot placement is a good deal of the battle and both 44 and 30-30 have the energy to get to the vitals on deer sized game. If they both work about as well close in (both have adiquate power to reach and disrupt/distroy the vitals) than I would say a 30-30 with a slight edge for flatter trajectory, which means that in equil hands a 30-30 would have a larger radius of doom.

 

[scoop10]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

Yep, +2...
35 Rem

 

[308/338]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

If you want a 44 mag. get it! I believe in ballistic charts not opinion based on someone lucky shot. If you can't decide on which caliber the 44 mag. or the 30/30 go with the 35 Rem. it can do what the 44 and 30/30 can do. if you reload or plan too a speer 180 gr. bullet at the velocity of 2300 fps. will equal a 300 savage in performance, a good deer load for dangerous or bigger game use the 200 gr or 220 gr. bullet. All three calibers will do a little better at longer shots with the leverevolution ammo.

 

[308/338]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I just gotta say the 44 mag. vs the 444 Mar. is starting to sound like the 308 vs the 30/06. But at least all agree on what you can shoot best with is the one to use.

 

[Gohon]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I would venture to say that several of the posters on here have taken probable several if not dozens of deer with the load and caliber they are talking about. I doubt very seriously if any of them feel all their shots if any were just lucky shots. Ballistics are fine as a starting point to work with but that's where it ends. Ballistics will tell you a 223 shooting a 55 grain bullet leaves the muzzle at 3200 fps with 1250 fpe where as a 45 Colt in a rifle with a 255 grain bullet is only traveling at 1509 fps and 1249 fpe. I think I know which one I would want to have in my hands when a bear charges out of the brush or even that trophy buck that suddenly popped up at 80 yards. The advantage of the 30-30 over the 44 magnum is only in distance and flatter trajectory at longer distance.

 

[davidl]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

I guess at very short range, the 44 30-30 work fine but the 30-06 and similar calibers offer so much more distance and killing ability. The 30-30 has killed a lot of deer here, but now no one uses them except beginners or people wanting a cheaper rifle. The 22 lr has killed a lot of deer and is capable if the shot is well placed, but I would not attempt it. I have two 30-30s and a 44 mag but if I am going deer hunting I will take my mod 70 30-06 because I know I have something a lot more versatile and powerful. With the right bullet they are hard to beat. Tennessee is now allowing deer hunting with 22 centerfire but I would not take my 22-250 either. I want all the odds I can get.

 

[Brian in FL]

Re: .44 mag "killing power" vs. .30-30

At typical woods ranges, the .30-30 or .44 magnum are plenty enough to get the job done and to spare. Now, don't get me wrong. I have a .30-06 that is one of my favorite rifles, but at woods ranges it is far more gun than I need to get the job done. I guess it boils down to personal preference, but, for me, I'll take one of my .35 Remingtons for woods hunting most of the time. Or one of my .30-30s will go with me into the woods, and I wouldn't feel undergunned in either case. Heck, I might even take my Marlin 1894C out if the game I was hunting were deer or even hogs with 180 grain bullets. The key is the range my shots are likely to be. In the thick stuff, handling is more important IMHO than brute strength or high velocity flat shooters. And there are very few rifles that handle better than Marlin lever guns.