Marlin Firearms Forum banner

1 - 11 of 11 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I need held to develop an accurate load for a 45acp 5'' 1911 pistol.:hmmmm: with the shortage of powder I have only blue dot and vithavouri n350 on hand. I would like to save the blue dot for other calibers. I will be shooting a dardas lead cast 200gr swc. I went to vv website and saw a recipe with 200gr fmj-ct with vv350 start 6.7 max 7.3. I was thinking to start at 6.8 and work up. any input would help me out a lot, thanks gents :)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
16,802 Posts
Hey Kimber,

When you can find a jug of Clays, you will be good.

230 gr LRN, 3.4 gr Clays, WLP. = 800 fps. Will work with an 18.5# spring. Low recoil, very accurate.

185 gr LSWC, 3.7 gr Clays, WLP = 775 fps. Will work with a 14# spring. Exceptional accuracy, negligible recoil.

Sorry, no help on the VV. (too pricey, the volume of .45 ammo that gets used around here)

Later, Mark
 
  • Like
Reactions: TNcaller

·
Registered
Joined
·
92 Posts
Kimber,
There are several aspects to your question. In looking at historical data from Pet Loads (vintage '78), Ken Waters found that 200gr SWC (lead) with 6.0 Unique was his #1 accuracy load across multiple pistols. I use that load a lot, and it is very accurate, but that doesn't help here because you don't have it available. He had very good results with Blue Dot, but primarily with jacketed bullets in 200 and 230gr. Using Blue Dot with 200gr SWC did not stand out in his testing. MSharley brings up Clays, and there are lots of other great powders with the 45ACP, but you don't have any of them either.
I don't have any experience with most of the VV powders, so, I looked up VV N350 (factory pub 5th ed., not sure what date), and they describe it as "slowest of the N300 series, similar to Blue Dot, Hi-Skor 800X or AC #7". They list the powder with 200 and 230 jacketed bullets, but not with SWC which indicates to me the results with SWCs were underwhelming. It will certainly go bang, but I'm not sure you'll get the accuracy you're hoping for.
Sounds to me like its a "pay your $ and take your chances" proposition.

KLD
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
thanks never thought about clays:hmmmm: i will keep it in mind when i visit my local haunts,i hate this shortage.i had some good loads now no powder. thanks again guys
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
16,802 Posts
m, you might want to chronograph that 3.4 Clays/230 LRN load again.
Hey 35,

Will do. If spring ever gets here. LOL (have done so, from multiple 1911's, slowest was 775 fps, fastest was 810 fps)

What are you "clocking"?

Later, Mark
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,565 Posts
Way slower than you, and more in line with what Hodgdon claims. I get 780 to 785 from multiple 1911's with various 2 radius ogive lead 230's, most I cast myself, from 4.0 grains Clays. This is more consistent with Hodgdon's data, enough so that I wonder if you're really dispensing 3.4 grains. When verifying, make sure the 3.4 is really 3.4.

775 to 810 from only 3.4 grains would set a new world's record for most velocity from the least charge weight for any powder used in 45 ACP, most likely. Clays gets good velocity per charge weight anyway, but 800 fps from only 3.4 grains would be way, way off the charts. Extrapolating from Hodgdon's 4 grain maximum would put you at about 880-900 in my guns, and I don't see anywhere near that.

What I see is that Clays is just a tad faster than Red Dot with equivalent charges. Your claimed velocities would make it way, way faster, and I am curious about that to the extent that somehow something's off. What is your OAL with these bullets you use?

Your claimed 775 with 3.7 grains under a 185 seems much more likely. That's closer to what I get. I've shot Clays extensively under a number of different bullet weights.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
16,802 Posts
Hey 35,

I will re visit this "conundrum". Having used Clays since it's introduction, (right about the time we "switched" to steel tables, for bowling pins), that load was my "go to" load for pins. Use 3.3 gr Clays, under a 255 gr LSWC, in the revolvers, for 780 fps.

My COAL, for a 230 gr LRN, is 1.238". (crimp is right on the "edge" of the front driving band of the Magma Engineering bullet)

If using a jacketed bullet (230 FMJ), I get 790 fps, from 4.0 gr Clays.

Later, Mark
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,565 Posts
Interesting. Hodgdon claims 732 fps using a Hornady 230 FMJ FP loaded to 1.200. Another conundrum. Given my results with less friction inducing LRN's and LFP's, 732 with a FMJ is about what I'd expect in my guns as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,120 Posts
My 3rd Edition VV manual lists a min charge of 6.8 for 932fps-max of 7.5 for 1011 with the 200FMJ-CT Hornady @1.240. Trouble is, they're using a 6" test barrel, not your 5". The manual does not list N350 with any cast bullet .45AUTO load. This isn't relavent to your question, but I've had good results with N350 in my USFA 7-1/2" SAA & 250GR bullets in .45 Colt. jd45
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
249 Posts
@kimber,

To return to your request about a VV N350 load for a cast 200 gr SWC, although I do not use VV powders (too expensive) I have run some calculations on Quickload for this powder. Here is a reasonable loading for a 5" barrel:

200 gr SWC / 8.4 gr VV N350 / 1.255 OAL
20565 psi / 1042 fps / 482 ft-lb / 88.5% Burn / 91.1% Fill

This powder looks like it is a little slow for this light of a bullet, but it should work OK if that is all you have.
 
1 - 11 of 11 Posts
Top