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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OK, let's try another one! Met a guy at a gun show who has a model 1894 from the late 1800's from the look. The gun is straight gripped, checkered, and marked "Model 1894" on the top tang. Buttplate is a stamped steel "S" type. Gun looks near pefect on the metal, with brilliant case colors, and rust blue. The checkering is 18LPI (lines per inch) and the barrel is marked Marlin Firearms Corporation, in a 20" round. Caliber is .25-20.
 

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Built after the war on an early receiver?moodyholler
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Possibly, but....what else? :wink:
 

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2 quickies, 25-20 wasn't available, 38-40 and 44-40 started followed by 32-20 if I remember right and would have been company not corporation, not sure but didn't they use a much finer checkering as well? more lines per inch.
 

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Wasn't it 24 LPI?? And a stab in the dark - Barrel incorrectly marked. And the casing was an option, so it was possible, especially with checkering.

Close????????

Shum8
 

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Did you get a chance to see the serial number and location? The "S" buttplate on rifles did not come until later on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Looks like everyone got a piece of it right! First thing that caught my eye was the coarse checkering. Early Marlins used 22 LPI checkering. The second thing was the S buttplate on an 1894 frame. Now I figured it was one of those leftover frames, as it had the Corporation marked 20" round barrel, so I wasn't so dead set anything else was wrong, but it did bring up danger signals!
When I checked the serial numbers, the triggerplate was a 400,000 range, but the upper tang and stock didn't match it, or even each other! Turned out this was a totally redone gun, made up of a early receiver, a bit later lower tang, and a lot later barrel and wood. Plus the addition of the checkering to try to make it look deluxe! If the person had stopped without checkering it, it might not have rang any alarms!
Funny thing was the seller acted totally surprised, and I was unsure if he was a good actor, or got taken himself.
Good work guys!
 

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mm93,

This one was out of my league but I sure am learning! Say your at a gun show and see a rifle you want to purchase. How do you approach taking off the stock. Obviously you ask the seller if it is alright with him. Do you have him do it or do you just pull out your Leatherman and have at it. What is kosher???????

Now I'll pull out Brophy and brush up on this S buttplate. I thought it was the normal crescent shape but now I'm unsure.

Mike Venturino had a great article in the latest Rifle magazine pointing out various terminology regarding lever guns. I learned quite abit from that regarding carbines versus short rifles. Good article I thought!

What is the most common alteration that you see that kind of spoils a fine old leveraction??? Cut barrel, extra dovetail, cut stock????????

Thanks for the quiz, if you can think of another or a hypothetical for that matter, try us out!

Geoff
 

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You can usually spot phony checkering - it just won't match the rest of the wood. Last phony I saw was an 1889 that was color-cased. I suppose there were a few special orders that way, but this one smelled new. Literally! The seller was evasive at first but finally said it had 'been gone over'.
 

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The only thing that I got right on this quiz is the "Bottom Line".

And......the Bottom Line is that you guys are GOOD when it comes to knowing your gun facts. I am a complete novice when it comes to gun specific identifications as such but I enjoy being able to learn as much as possible from all of you. Marlinman93, it is a darn shame that you live all the way across the country because I have enjoyed your input for the past few years now. You and Parley Bear were two of the first that I remember with such a vast knowledge of manufacturing details, styles, dates, etc. I remember when I had questions on my Model 1936, 30-30 and I was amazed that you guys were able to tell me every detail of my gun. I was impressed then and I continue to be impressed with the knowledge that is shared here for all of us novices to learn from.

Even though I don't own such relics as the early models, I find it interesting to read about the details made available from all of you gun savvy enthusiasts. I consider all of you to be good teachers in the course of "Firearm Details.... Especially For Marlins". Thanks for helping making this board such a great place to visit each day.
 

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Eagle Eye,

Good to see a fresh name on the forum!! :D Also another 444 nut! 8) My 444P gets shot more than any other Marlin these days. What variety of Marlins do you collect? SW
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Geoff,
I would never ask a seller to take off the stock, until it reached a point of agreeing on a price. Once you've made an offer, it goes something like this, "I'll give you X amount, if it's all correct" If the dealer accepts, then your next question should be, "Will you remove the buttstock, or may I, to check the numbers?" I carry a pocket sized Chapman screwdriver set, so if the seller balks and says he would if he had a correct screwdriver, I can "help him out".
The most common thing I see is restored guns. mostly poorly cold blued, or professionally restored, and passed off as original pristine. The pristine guns often have refinished wood, and they rarely get all the oil out of the wood, so it's a dead giveaway. Some of the cold blued guns are pretty well done, but most are really wrecks. Here's a tip for you. If you think the metal has been cold blued, rub it with your thumb as you look it over. After you've rubbed in one spot with firm pressure, then put that spot to your nose and sniff. It will smell acrid just like cold blue. If you smell this, then pass on it, unless it's priced accordingly.
Eagle Eye,
Glad to see your posts again. Missed you around here, and it's been a long time since I've seen your name pop up in the Collector's thread! Thanks for all the flattering words. Wish we could see more of Parley here too. As you mentioned, he is a really knowledgeable source, and I hope he jumps back in more often!
 

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mm93,

More great wisdom that you have passed on!

Hey I got further into that latest edition of RIFLE magazine. Mike Venturino has quite an article in there on the Remington rolling block. I know when you get to your level it gets harder to find something you didn't know already but thought you might like to get that issue. I haven't read the article yet but noticed there is a pic of a sporter in .44-77 and I think that is the one you just got. You may find something of interest.

I sure agree about Parley Bear. He's helped me out quite afew times as well. Heck of a lot to be learned here thats for sure!

Geoff
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks Geoff! I'll have to go look at that copy of Rifle. I have Mike Venturino's book Shooting Buffalo Rifles, but there may well be more in his article to learn! I'm a bit of a novice to the .44-77, as I haven't owned one, and only know one guy who has an original Sharps in that caliber.
 

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Geoff,
The most common alteration I seem to run into is cut barrels. I don't know why - but it seems so many that I see were cut down. It is the first thing I look for.
The second is refinished wood. This is also a popular one. I think because throughout the years a guy would get some nicks and dings in his prized rifle and for a few bucks - the cost of a do-it-yourself refinishing kit - he could slap a new coat of varnish on it in his basement and make it "just like new again".
The third is the sights have been changed. A LOT of older rifles don't have the original sights. This doesn't bother me so much, though, as I have a stash of original sights that I have picked up over the years, stuck away just for that reason.

WB
 

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NebrHogger,
I am not a collector of sorts (unless you include dust according to my wife), but I really do read this forum and about every one of the others here every day. I just enjoy learning about the older models that are true collectors items. It is always interesting reading. You guys have a fine group here with such a wealth of knowledge. I have found calibers here that I never knew existed and that is the fun part of learning new facts etc.

The only older gun that I have is the Model 1936. The rest are all modern Marlins made from the 60's forward. I have several 30-30's, 22 cal. and of course 444 cal. I have been an avid hunter since back in the early 60's and along the way, I have acquired several shotguns of various makes, models and also a few handguns. I just enjoy the outdoors and being able to hunt and fish sure makes for good relaxation.
 
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