[oldtrooper]

Without a doubt, this has been addressed on this forum at some time but I can't it.
I've ordered some .460 Beartooth 350 gr. Piledriver Lites in hopes of using them on mule deer and elk. Since I have IMR4198 it's what I plan to use. I'm shooting for 1900 to 2000 fps out of my 1895SS with the 22" barrel. Any help with load data and performance will be greatly appreciated.

 

[AJYaros]

you have any reloading manuals? lyman has a decent number of loads. i'm using their suggested load for 405 and 300gr with IMR 4198

 

[Plano]

.

Hey Oldtrooper,

Unless you just like to abuse yourself you don't need that kind of velocity. Something around 1500 to 1600 fps is adequate for anything in North America. The 45-70 is not a magnum regardless of what Alaska State Troopers on TV calls it. Loads of around 30 grains would do the job.

 

[Crusty Deary Ol Coot]

Oldtrooper,

I'd agree that you don't need the 1900 - 2000fps velocity.

I took my first 45/70 deer with a 355gr Wide Flat Nose (WFN) cast at a velocity of about 2300fps. Waaaaay to much of a bad thing and way over kill.

Must preferred is my current 465gr WFN at 1650fps.

Much better consistency and groups with the over 400gr bullets.

That bullet and velocity is Flat out deadly on deer and elk!

Hard to come by some powders at this point of time, but you rifle may show a preference to another powder.

I tried a number of powder including IMR4198 and ended up using another choice.

Welcome to the forum and keep us posted as to your results.

 

[GaCop]

Any load pushing 1650 to 1700 fps should work well on Mulies and Elk at a reasonable distance, especially if your using iron sights.

 

[Grey Duster]

I havent chrono ed my loads but I shoot 38 grains of IMR 4198 and push a Remington 405 grain soft point round nose along quite nicely. Made cloverleafs at 100 yards. I have found that load to be a good shooter for me and it doesnt beat you to death or dislocate your shoulder. Works well for me.

 

[bikerbean]

oldtrooper,

The hodgdon load database on their website doesn't have a load listed for a 350g lead projectile using I4198. They do have a load listed for a Levergun using I4198 and 350g jacketed bullet, but the start load velocity is higher than velocity range you are looking to achieve. The hodgdon data is available at Hodgdon - The Gun Powder People.

I looked at the data at Beartooth's website (LoadSwap.com , IIRC) and didn't see what you are looking for but I might have missed it as there are several listings for the 45-70.

BB

 

[Crusty Deary Ol Coot]

Bikerbean,

The Lyman Cast bullet book has info for the IMR 4198 which is what the original poster seems to be interested in.

He says he has some of that version, but does not list any other available powders.

I sent him the Lyman/IMR info on another thread he had started on the subject.

Maybe Oldtrooper will come back and tell us is he has other powders available.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

 

[Vic in Va]

I use a load with the Piledriver Jr and H4198 that runs around 1635 fps or so. 40 grains in a Starline case, with a WLR primer. Using the 350 grain bullet ought not run too much faster, I doubt over 1700 fps.


Edited to add: Actually Quickload shows it slowing down due to less pressure. Using the parameters that match my load in my rifle, I get 1625 fps using published dimensions on the Piledriver Lite. Recoil is also at 21 ft-lbs with my rifle, which is a Guide gun. An 1895 or Cowboy would obviously be faster.

That would be a pleasant load to shoot, and I'm sure quite effective on game.

 

[Crusty Deary Ol Coot]

Good choice on velocity Vic!

I took one deer with a Wide Flat Nose cast of 355gr and a muzzle velocity of about 2300fps and NEVER want to see that level of meat loss, size of wound channel AGAIN!!!!!!!

My 45/70 with 465gr WFN at 1650fps is simply awesome on deer and elk!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

 

[Vic in Va]

CDOC, I'd tell ya how well that bullet does at that velocity, but ain't nothing stopped one yet!! All's I get out of the deal is a carcass. No spent bullets.....:biggrin:

 

[Crusty Deary Ol Coot]

Vic,

I did retrieve one of the 465gr WFN cast from my 45/70.

ELK!

Velocity about 1650fps range about 100yds, and I was really surprised to ever find one of these bullets!

Front quartering shot, took out the big/heavy front shoulder bone, a rib, through the lungs, all the way through a big and really full paunch and stopped just under the hide in front of the off side ham.

Started about 465gr +/- and ended up at 327.9gr.

Clearly this boolit took a real beating and did a lot of hard work, but it still almost made it through.

Doubt I'll ever find another one!

Sure hope to get another chance at a moose before my years run out. The 45/70 and I are READY!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

 

[Chris623]

Without a doubt, this has been addressed on this forum at some time but I can't it.
I've ordered some .460 Beartooth 350 gr. Piledriver Lites in hopes of using them on mule deer and elk. Since I have IMR4198 it's what I plan to use. I'm shooting for 1900 to 2000 fps out of my 1895SS with the 22" barrel. Any help with load data and performance will be greatly appreciated.

First off, I'd like to arm wrestle you for that 4198! Can't find any around here to try. Second, I'm no expert, but those who are will tell you 1200-1400fps with a 450gr Piledriver will kill anything in North America. I'd think the 350gr wouldn't be any less devastating. Unless you just enjoy braggin' to the ladies you shoot at those higher velocities, and your shoulder just happens to love being creamed, I'd recommend you work up a load that is as deadly as a freight train. (ever seen a freight train hit a truck?) Heavy and slow makes a big hole going in and coming out. Results? Bang-Flop!

 

[Crusty Deary Ol Coot]

Chris is correct about the recoil.

Shot up the left over 355gr at 2300fps loads late last Summer and the recoil is MUCH SHARPER with those loads then the 465gr at 1650fps.

Those big and heavy WFN cast bullet are awesome!

CDOC

 

[Chris623]

Well, as I said, I'm not expert. Heck, the only thing I've killed with a Marlin is a paper target!

 

[Hipshot]

PrecisionReloading.com shows both H4198 and IMR 4198 IN STOCK. They are located in S. Dakota.

Hip

 

[Chris623]

Thanks, Hipshot. I don't order powder or primer on-line. Local purchases only.

 

[XxWoodsHunterxX]

Thanks, Hipshot. I don't order powder or primer on-line. Local purchases only.

Why not if the deal is worth paying hazmat.

 

[Chris623]

Well............I checked Precision Reloading.com, and it wasn't worth the Hazmat fee. Which is why I don't order powder or primers on-line.

 

[XxWoodsHunterxX]

Powder valley recobs are two of many that you can order from. I just found a guy with 8# 4198 for $169