Marlin Firearms Forum banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
232 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
If you have a bone stock Mikuro built 45-70 Winchester 1886 (extra light model) what is the max C.O.L for it?

I found a mess of 350 grain bullets that when loaded measure 2.66
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
6,347 Posts
Do they fit? You see, we don't have the rifle, you do. The only way to know what the max COL is would be to make one a tad long and keep checking the fit until it fits your chamber AND works through your magazine also. I'm not being evasive, but nothing published is going to be able to tell you the max for your rifle. ONLY your rifle knows and it will tell you. The SAAMI spec should work through all actions, but will not necessarily be max in any of them. Lots of guys take an unsized case, slip a bullet in the end and place it in the chamber. Where the bullet stops from being pushed in by the rifling is "the max" for that particular rifle, as long as it still works through the magazine. A thousandth or two shorter may prevent the bullet from bumping the rifling ever. That would be a good thing.

I see your join date as Sep 2005. Where ya been for nearly 9 years? Anyway, welcome back!

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
232 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Rifle is not yet in my hands or I would try to run some dummy rounds through it. It should be here by the time I return from a trip. Some of the shooters I talked to said these 1886's have small throats so I was just trying to find someone who owned one of these rifles and could offer there opinion.
Thanks, I never left.......just didn't own any more levers until now:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sweetwater

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,429 Posts
A Lee book, shows 2 550 as max. the max in the lever guns cartridges are directly related to the action lengths. There is a difference between a "small throat" and a short throat. The 1895 marlins are noted for a tight throat, and at times, the bullets are not sized small enough. Now, if a guy was using a heavy bullet in a 45 70, one for lets say a 500 grain Sharps rifle, if they loaded to the crimp groove, they might be too long to function but not because of the throat length. If you seated them to the 2 550 spec, they would function just fine.

If memory serves, the typical factory 45 70 load, had a 405 grain bullet for the trap door and lever guns. The carbine trapdoor, may have been 350 grains to offer less recoil, but again, I am going by memory.

If the round is too long, it wont fit into the carrier and will catch on the edge of the mag tube. Point being, the throat length is likely the least of your worries as far as OAL. You might do as Sweetwater suggests, and the gun work fine in single shot mode, but load it into the magazine, it may lock up tighter than dicks hatband.

I run into the reverse issue on a Marlin 1894 when using the 85 grain bullets in a 32 20. The round is too short, thus the next round comes back and interferes with the carrier moving up. A similar jam may happen if you load the longer heavier bullets too long in a 45 70, only it wont be able to move far enough back into the carrier to clear the mag tube junction.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sweetwater

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
6,347 Posts
All true, RGR, which is why I also specified "as long as it still works through the magazine" - most of my lever guns will work 2.60" OAL which is one reason I build for the gun, not the spec sheet. YMMV

Jeff
 
  • Like
Reactions: JBledsoe

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Rifle is not yet in my hands or I would try to run some dummy rounds through it. It should be here by the time I return from a trip. Some of the shooters I talked to said these 1886's have small throats so I was just trying to find someone who owned one of these rifles and could offer there opinion.
Thanks, I never left.......just didn't own any more levers until now:)
I was just over at Cast Boolits forum reading about these and trying to decide which mold I wanted to buy. The guys there were VERY straightforward in telling me there was pretty much NO throat on these rifles but I can't say as I haven't done a chamber cast on mine yet.

Art
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,803 Posts
If you have a bone stock Mikuro built 45-70 Winchester 1886 (extra light model) what is the max C.O.L for it?

I found a mess of 350 grain bullets that when loaded measure 2.66
I never measured the COL of the cartridges but I've been firing the Buffalo Bore and HSM 430 grain hard cast lead factory rounds in my Japchester 1886 Extra Light in 45-70 GVT all week.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,803 Posts
I never measured the COL of the cartridges but I've been firing the Buffalo Bore and HSM 430 grain hard cast lead factory rounds in my Japchester 1886 Extra Light in 45-70 GVT all week.
Just measured a HSM 430 grain factory round at 2.50" COL.
Guess that doesn't help you much. :hmmmm:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,429 Posts
So its .005 under max, that load should in theory, feed through any factory lever gun just fine. But as Tazman found, the throat length is as well established by SAMMI specs. A guy could run the heaviest bullet found in a factory mold, but one would lose powder capacity if held too the SAMMI lever gun max length. Which perhaps in a lever gun pressure limits, would not see much difference anyway.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
150 Posts
I had a Browning 1886, which was also made by Miroku. In that rifle, without alterations, the max OAL I could cycle was around 2.65/2.66". The bigger issue was the throating. My rifle had no throat and I believe all Miroku 45/70's are the same. That will be your biggest limiting factor.

The throat can be opened up but if you do, take it to smith that will do it properly. The rifle can be modified to accept cartridges with a much longer LOA - up to around 2.88". However once modified you can't reliably cycle cartridges of significantly shorter LOA.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
395 Posts
overall length

The RCBS 405 grain gc cast 45-70 measure 2.510 overall and shoot and feed very accurately through both my 86 and all of the Marlin rifles I have owned over the years.
I don't shoot any jacketed bullets in 45-70, it just doesn't seem right.:biggrin:
 
  • Like
Reactions: JBledsoe

·
Registered
Joined
·
632 Posts
My Browning 1886 will feed from the magazine Lyman 457125 500 gr. Round Nose bullets. Crimped in the top grease groove. 2.825 OAL.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
526 Posts
Would the short throat in the 1886's also be the same in the Jap 1885's in 45-70?
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top