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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Marlin Model 32-38 Pump Research Project

Well I just bought my 3rd Model 38 and am looking at a 4th, along with a Model 32. So I have decided devote some time to this lesser know Marlin hammerless pumps.


My goal is to start a data base of serial numbers and features that should help in dating the Model 38, made from 1921-22 to early 1931.Have 2-31 price sheet to confirm this.
I included the Model 32, made 1915, because I think that the early 38's, might have used existing Model 32 recievers that were left
over, and also overlapped with the serial numbers.


This is a theory of mine that I want to check out. This would mean that even-though the highest ser# of 5957 was observed,on 32's.
There may have been considerably less 32's made than that. (Just added 6/30/12)-- It is possible that the Model 32 Ser#5957 might have been assembled as late as 1924-25.
If number is stamped on the outside lower receiver. It is very likely. Would love to see this one.

Considering that in one of my 1915 catalogs there is stamped on the Model 32 page,"THIS .22 HAMMERLESS REPEATER WILL BE READY IN SEPTEMBER"
In the next 1915 catalog that came with a May 10th 1916 price sheet, there is stamped on the Model 32 page,"DISCONTINUED UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE"


Parley Baer has been collecting info on the Mo.93 and Mo.94 Marlins and Gewehr has been working on a data base for the Model 47 pump.
I have been helping them out when I can. And while looking for 32's and 38's have found a few more for both of them.
So help them out if you can.


So far I have looked all over the internet and have found (151)-38's and (8)-32's. Some of those are only S/N, but many have info that I
can use to help make the picture a little clearer. It already is showing some patterns as to when they were made.
But there are 28,125 to 30,125 to go. Will have to see what it looks like with a few more.


So if you are an owner of a Marlin Model 32 or 38 pump, or you know of anyone else that would like to help with information, and pictures if you like.
I know I would like see some more pictures of this great little pump.

You can contact me by PM. There are a few items I need so I will give a list.
You can write down the number of the question and the the answer right after it.

If you want to leave picture on this thread, I am sure that others here would like to see them also. But just the pictures only.
Leave the info to the PM's or E-Mail's. Backgroud story, if you like, should be no problem.

All Information provided in the PM's and E-mail's will be considered confidential,and published only with owners consent.


Thanks up front for any help that you can provide.



Left click On pictures to enlarge, and left click again, to enlarge to full size.
Right click to save.

I will start the pictures out with the first 3 of mine. I am waitng for the third 38 with a A-prefix to show up at my FFL. Update pic below.

The first is a earlier than what Brophy had seen, when he wrote his book. #7XX, with Corporation stamp with Patents Pending. 7XX.jpg Also catalogs from 1922-30
Marlin Safety buttplate,No bullseye or Star and ser# is located inside on both upper and lower receiver. 1st type bolt.


The next is a hard to find Marlin Rockwell barrel #15XX there are others in this range and others in the 3 digit range. Model 38  15XX.jpg Checkering was not stock.
Marlin Safety buttplate,No bullseye or Star and ser# is located inside on both upper and lower receiver. 1st type bolt.


My 3rd is a Round barrel, Corporation stamp with 1922 patent date, has Ser# on lower receiver,Marlin oval buttplate ,bullseye and Star #A84XX. A84XX.jpg
1st type bolt.

Thank again

Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
The information that I need. If you need any other picture to help you answer this let me know.


#1 ____ Model 32 or 38


#2 _________ Ser# including prefix if it has one.
If one isn't visible, you can find it ether on the inside top of the barreled receiver or by taking off the stock and looking at the side of the tang on the lower receiver.


#3 _________ Ser# loction = Inside or outside


#4 _________ Barrel type = Oct.or Rd.


#5 _______ Magazine type = latch or button


#6 _____ Full langth magazine = Yes or No


#7 ____ Barrel Stamp 5+ possible. Pick one and mark. = A,B,C,D,E,F

A = Marlin Firearms Co. NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July 13, 20 1915


B = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915


C = Marlin-Rockwell Corp. NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915


D = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915.Patent Pending


E = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CONN,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915.April.11.June.6.1922


F = Different from above. What is different ? Or take picture.


_____________________________________________________________


_____________________________________________________________


#8 _____ Bullesye = Yes or No


#9 _____ Star = Yes or No -----> If (Yes) on Star,were is it located? _________ = Star locations.jpg Stock has to be removed to see one on lower tang.

#10 ____ Buttplate = A or B

A = MARLIN and SAFETY on top and bottom of a circle---Look at my 1st and second gun, on first post.


B = MARLIN in an oval-------- Look at my 3rd gun, on first post.


#11 ______ Type of bolt = 1st or 2nd --- Model 38 Bolts.jpg The second was probably only used in the last 1 or 2 years. Haven't seen any yet to tell.


#12 Comments- Anything special or not stock on gun.


_____________________________________________________________________________________
 

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Hi

I have a Model 32 with a lower 3 digit serial number. I can tell you the Model 32 is very, very scarce. So if you see one and want one get it. Mine has a Marlin Firearms Corporation barrel on it so it was assembled sometime during or after 1922. Has the Swebilius rear sight. I will try and get more information for you.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks Parley Baer I have several more numbers for you, I just need to round them up.

I did just pass on a 32 on Gunbrokers, if it wouldn't of had a crack the full length of the stock and a bolt going through it, I would have bid more. Maybe I should have? O well.

At this point my list has 7 32's, of the 38's, I have 31 w/o prefix, 38 A-prefix, 10 D-prefix. I just got my A84XX the other day. I have to get a picture on here tonight.
So I still need a D and one of each barrel stamp on the 32's. I am waiting for the price to drop a bit on the D. The 32's will probably be some time till I get those.
Will have to save up to buy them, or sell something. But wont sell a Marlin:biggrin:
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Updated+++ Picture of my 3rd Model 38 with round barrel added to first post.

Also here is a picture of the 38 taken down.
Model 38 Takedown size.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Update on numbers found on internet so far. Updated 05/09/13 New low in the NO prefix, and New high A prefix.
8 -mod.32's
151 -mod.38's of those 56 are No-prefix, 73 are A-prefix, 22 are D-prefix.


Also update on Low a high serial numbers. Red shows change.

The numbers below only represent the Serial Numbers that Brophy had seen, and reported in his book. And I Serial Numbers that I have come across, up to this point.
So there could very well be a 001, A001 ,or a D001, but if there is, I haven't seen them yet.

Brophy's Model 32
Low 194 High 5957

New numbers Model 32
Low 182 High 5957


Brophy's Model 38
No-prefix Low 782 High 10938
A -prefix Low A206 High A11389
D -prefix Low D272 High D1739


New Numbers Model 38
No-prefix Low 6XX High 10983----------- note on low number- another with Marlin Rockwell supposedly lower than 782 but only showing XXX.
A -prefix Low A206 High A11402--------- note on low number- an AXX and a AXXX that is supposed to be below A206.Nothing to substantiate yet.
D -prefix Low D147 High D1923

Also checked to see if there was any overlap with the model 93's and 94's. I found 4 matching numbers so far.

ser#192 Model 32 and 94
ser#873 Model 32 and 93
ser#1313 Model 38 and 94
ser#5503 Model 38 and 93

Trends are still showing up, but finding more might change that.
 

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Hi Schtoolee,
Just joined the forum Mate.
I am waiting for the paperwork to clear so that I can pick up a model 38 I just bought last week.
It is as new an appears to have never been fired, so I was happy to part with some of my "gun money" to make it my own.
It is pretty rare to see older Marlins in Australia, and especially one in this condition.
I would love to send you the info you are chasing and will do so when I pick my 38 up.
Good luck with your quest for information.
Will.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Welcome William Henry to Marlin Owners. We have several Australian's here, and we are always happy, to have another.
I have spotted a few 38's overseas, while doing my searching of the internet. A couple in the UK , one in New Zealand, and last night I spotted one in Australia.
So that means, there are at least 2 over there.

P.S. Also, not sure if you know or not. You only want to shoot standard velocity ammo though your 38. I shoot CCI brand, but any 22 S,L,Lr in the 1100 FPS or slower should work.
The shorts at 710FPS are very quite. So while you are waiting, buy up a bunch of shells. Once you start shooting they wont last long.
:biggrin:

So, thank you for the help. And good luck with you new Marlin.
Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #9

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
And of the next 4,I have only seen the first 2 stamped on the later Model 38's. And when the barrel says patents pending, these are it.
View attachment US1412298_Apr_11_1922.pdf
View attachment US1418862_June_6_1922.pdf
View attachment US1587049_June_ 1_1926.pdf This is for a Button mag release that I have yet to see on a 38.
View attachment US1702063_Feb_12_1929.pdf This is for the 2 type bolt. So far I have a bolt that came out of D752 and that is still the first type. So has to be in the later D's.


Low and High Serial numbers updated on post 6. New Low in the D prefix.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Added 4 more today to my list today. 3 from Gewehr and 1 from Lukec. Finally saw the Star stamped on the lower inside tang, left side, on a couple of Gewehr's. Also meet with Gewehr and bought a nice 29-N pump .22 and meet Luke and his family at the sale. Luke was the one looking for a mag tube for a 38 and Gewehr was able to help.

Anyway thanks for the gun and the conversation on Marlins.

While there I realized I should probably put a Parts brakedown for anyone that needs one. Here it is. Also a couple pages from a 1926-30 catalog.
1936-38 Model 32-38 parts.jpg 1929 pg6-7.jpg
 

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Bill

I have a Model 38 hammerless octagon pump 22 ... but I have no serial number I have been able to find ... gun is in excellent shape ...

22 Marlin Rifle - Model 38 – no serial - Octagon
barrel, 22 pump, hammerless, push button takedown, "The Marlin Firearms
Corporation, New Haven, Conn, USA Pat'd Mar 17, Sept 15, 1914 July 13, 20, 1915
Patent Pending Marlin Mod 38, 22, S-L & L.R" is on barrel, excellent,
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I have a Model 38 hammerless octagon pump 22 ... but I have no serial number I have been able to find ... gun is in excellent shape ...

22 Marlin Rifle - Model 38 – no serial - Octagon
barrel, 22 pump, hammerless, push button takedown, "The Marlin Firearms
Corporation, New Haven, Conn, USA Pat'd Mar 17, Sept 15, 1914 July 13, 20, 1915
Patent Pending Marlin Mod 38, 22, S-L & L.R" is on barrel, excellent,
Bill on the earlier guns the ser# can be seen by ether removing the bolt, it is stamped inside on the the top of the receiver. And also if you remove the stock, it is stamped on the side of the tangs.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Coper here is a picture of the safety detent and spring, with dimensions. Hopefully this will help. I looked at one place I know and they don't have springs that size.
I am sure they are out there somewhere. Anyone removing this be very careful, I lost both parts when putting back together. Toke awhile, but finally found in the carpet.:vollkommenauf:
Safety detent and spring.jpg Found a place that has some that are .088 wide.Should work, the pin is .0895.But only .012 wire size. But still might work.
Only problem is you have to buy 6 at 3.25 each, plus shipping. $26.45 for one spring. This is the first place I found, I am sure there are others.
W.B. Jones Spring Company:springs manufacturer, coil, compression, torsion, extension springs
 

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I am assuming that the spring goes in then the safety dent goes in smaller side first? Is it a press fit in or does the safety hold it in after you install it??? and the wire is size .015 and is .188 long and .084 wide correct? I will call around to see if i can find some maybe a 6 inch spring that I can cut down.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I am assuming that the spring goes in then the safety dent goes in smaller side first?
Yes

Is it a press fit in or does the safety hold it in after you install it???
No!
I put the safety back together, or so I thought. And that was when I know-test the detent and spring was gone. I found the detent right away, but it toke about a 1/2 hour to find the spring.
So be careful when you put it back together.

the wire is size .015 and is .188 long and .084 wide correct? I will call around to see if i can find some maybe a 6 inch spring that I can cut down.
The length is .155

P.S. You can make the picture larger by clicking on it.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
This is to let anyone that needs a stock for there Model 32 and Model 38 pumps. Gunville now makes them. I sent one of mine in to have a copy made. I got a AA grade made up and will post a picture when I get it.
20130207_010611.jpg 20130207_010649.jpg
They also have the standard grade listed on E-bay, for the same price as the web sight.

Gunville Gun Stocks and Silver Hill Co.- Gun Stocks and Gun Parts
 

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Schtoolee-

I have my great grandfathers model 38 take down pump. This great little rifle has a lot of family history and it fires/shoots accurately except for one major issue: The rifle will not extract the spent casing or lift a new round up into the receiver.

I have a letter written to my father in 1975 by a William S Brophy, Sr Technical Manager of the Marlin Firearms Co. stating that there are no remaining records about the manufacture of this rifle, a little history on the model 32 and regrets that they are unable to furnish partsnot know of any sources.

Questions:
1) how do I determine what part is missing?
2) are there any places to look for replacement parts?
3) Are there any specs to have a gunsmith fabricate missing parts
4) Do you have any recommendations?

I love this rifle, will NOT ever sell it for sentimental reasons and I would love to get it back to 100% working order

NOTE: I completed the questionare for your project (assuming you are still interested)

I appreciate any advice you have to offer
#1 _38_ Model 32 or 38


#2 _A102XX__ Ser# including prefix if it has one.
If one isn't visible, you can find it ether on the inside top of the barreled receiver or by taking off the stock and looking at the side of the tang on the lower receiver.


#3 _outside on the bottom receiver and a matching # inside top receiver __ Ser# loction = Inside or outside


#4 __round__ Barrel type = Oct.or Rd.


#5 __Button__ Magazine type = latch or button


#6 _No_ Full length magazine = Yes or No


#7 _E_ Barrel Stamp 5+ possible. Pick one and mark. = A,B,C,D,E,F

A = Marlin Firearms Co. NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July 13, 20 1915


B = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915


C = Marlin-Rockwell Corp. NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915


D = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915.Patent Pending


E = The Marlin Firearms Corporation NEW HAVEN,CT,U.S.A.
PATD.Mar.17.Sept.15.1914.July.13.20.1915.April.11. June.6.1922


F = Different from above. What is different ? Or take picture.


__________________________________________________ ___________


__________________________________________________ ___________


#8 _Yes_ Bullesye = Yes or No


#9 _Yes_ Star = Yes or No -----> If (Yes) on Star,were is it located? _Top Tang__ = Stock has to be removed to see one on lower tang.

#10 _B_ Buttplate = A or B

A = MARLIN and SAFETY on top and bottom of a circle---Look at my 1st and second gun, on first post.


B = MARLIN in an oval-------- Look at my 3rd gun, on first post.


#11 _1st__ Type of bolt = 1st or 2nd ---The second was probably only used in the last 1 or 2 years. Haven't seen any yet to tell.


#12 Comments- Anything special or not stock on gun. (The are two screws near the star on the tang to hold a peep site)
 

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Discussion Starter #19
CBergen Welcome to Marlin Owners. Thank you for the info on your gun. I would say it was built around 1929-30. And is the first one on my list to have the button type magazine.
I am adding a larger picture of the Bolt and I numbered the parts in question. You can also download a copy of the parts sheet, by ether right click to make picture larger or
left clicking on it, to save the picture, with your mouse.
1st type Model 38 numberd.jpg Let me know if you need anymore help and or the contact info for a Carrier.

It sounds like there is a problem with the 20K Carrier, that lifts the cartridge up from the magazine. Dos it still have the hook on it? Or is the carrier gone all together?
If most of it is there, I can help out with dimensions of the part that is broken off, otherwise I might know someone that might have the part.

And ether 37K Extractor Right side or the 39K Right Extractor spring or the 40K Extractor left side or the 42K Left Extractor Spring. It is possible that just the springs are bad.
If it is one or both of the extractors, they are available at Numrich. If it is just the spring, you might find springs at a local hardware that could be cut down to work.
The pins are just pushed in, and are held there by the spring pressure. Just use something to pry them out. And watchout for flying springs.

Extractor, Right Gun Parts | 452330 | Numrich Gun Parts

Extractor, Left Gun Parts | 452460 | Numrich Gun Parts
 

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Schtoolee-

Thank you for the welcome and the thorough analysis and reply

I have attached a composite photo for your review:
Model 38 Bolt composite views.jpg

1) It looks like the 20K Carrier that lifts the cartridge up from the magazine is missing all together?
2) It looks like a screw (9K and 10k?) at the bottom are missing (they must hold the carrier in place)?
3) It seems both the 37K Extractor Right side, 39K Right Extractor spring, 40K Extractor left side and 42K Left Extractor Spring appear to be in place?

I am very interested in your observations.

If you know where I might get the parts I would be very grateful!

BTW ..I’ve also included a picture of the end of the tubular magazine …so you can tell me if it’s a latch or a button.
Model 38 magazine button-latch.jpg
Respectfully
CBergen
 
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