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I was at the range the other day shooting a flintlock, and a guy and his young son were shooting next to me. The dad was getting his son (9 or so) ready for youth season with two different rifles, a Marlin 336c in .30-30 and a generic .243 of some sort. We got to talking, and I asked why two rifles, and was told the ".30-30 is for brush hunting, and it's only good to about 75 yards". When I asked why he thought so, he responded, "Everybody knows that!" So he proceeded to teach me by showing me the target at 50 yards. First, the kid couldn't shoot a 12" group at 50 yards from a rest, and what bullets did hit were indeed "grouped" (about 8", hard to tell with a buckshot pattern) low. Dad thought that was a result of "bullet drop", and when he shot at 100 yards, it showed twice the "drop", proving that a .30-30 is at the very extreme limit, a 75 yards gun. I explained to him to raise the sight elevator, and actually sight the gun in for 100 yards or so, and he would see remarkably less "bullet drop". Clueless, might as well been speaking Zwahili. Couldn't comprehend that the bullet wasn't dropping, it was just going where the sights were aligned. No amount of instruction or offering to help raise the rear sight was going to change his mind that the ".30-30 is at best, a 75 yard brush gun." Gun stores love ignorance like that, it keeps them selling new guns every year that are "flatter shooting". Don't even get me started with the dad and son who bought a brand new bolt rifle in .223, threw a scope on it without sighting in, and then couldn't hit a target at 12 yards (wobbling, offhand, as they left the 25 yard bench to get closer) and swore they were "going to get their money back for a defective gun!" I'm about done hunting with these kind of folks in the woods.
 

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I WOULDNT HAVE EVEN ENGAGED ANYBIDY THAT STUPID.
they likely wont harvest a deer but they may cripple up a few. if that kid cant hold steady across a bench he damn sure wont with a deer in his sights.
and the sad thing is, people like this hit the woods every year in droves.
 

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I WOULDNT HAVE EVEN ENGAGED ANYBIDY THAT STUPID.
they likely wont harvest a deer but they may cripple up a few. if that kid cant hold steady across a bench he damn sure wont with a deer in his sights.
and the sad thing is, people like this hit the woods every year in droves.
One of the few reasons i dont hunt anymore.

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You want to see a bunch of ignorance without getting any on you? Go to the question and answer blogs at firearms or accessories dealers sites. The level of both ignorance and stupidity is astounding.

New Libs and ANTIFA goonies trying out firearms is amusing. You can read them like a book. First sentence is a giveaway. The Libs are just pathetic, like they would play jacks out on the Interstate. The ANTIFAs want to know how to kill the Fascists, but don't have the slightest idea how firearms work. And they have to mask their purpose in vague terms, vague questions. A lot of them have Police records, so hang out at Black Powder sites or retailers. No 4473 paperwork with cartridge firing conversion cylinders. Every so often there's an angry outburst. Most ANTIFAs are fairly illiterate, Common Core didn't do them any favors. Somebody's gonna get hurt.
 

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I WOULDNT HAVE EVEN ENGAGED ANYBIDY THAT STUPID.

The sad thing is, people like this hit the woods every year in droves.
The first part of your post made me giggle, but the second part I quoted is sadly true. We have no blaze orange laws in BC, and up to a year ago, I never wore any in my 52 years. Last year, and this year, I’m all about the blaze except when hunting turkeys or waterfowl.
 

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The sad part is that 9 year old is an information sponge at this age. As a dad you owe it to your kid to educate yourself before contaminating him. My 2 boys (10 and 12) are learning every trip to the field. My 10 year old goes on his first hunt next week. My 12 year old shot his first antelope last week. Both have already shot a couple hundred rounds this summer. We just finished our final scouting trip Saturday. This dad must do better.
 

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As a hunter safety instructor for many years, I find this kind of irresponsible behavior appalling. Anyone who uses a firearm who believes that they are above learning in a situation such as this, is a disaster in the making. Someone will suffer catastrophic consequences as a result of this type of scenario - not if - but when! You can't fix stupid.
I personally can't see putting a 9 year old with likely limited experience behind the trigger of a .30-30 or any centerfire rifle.
Please understand that this is my personal opinion and it is likely not to be in agreement with the thinking of others.
 

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The sad part is that 9 year old is an information sponge at this age. As a dad you owe it to your kid to educate yourself before contaminating him. My 2 boys (10 and 12) are learning every trip to the field. My 10 year old goes on his first hunt next week. My 12 year old shot his first antelope last week. Both have already shot a couple hundred rounds this summer. We just finished our final scouting trip Saturday. This dad must do better.


This is precisely the reason for the past 40 years ive dreamed of OWNING my own piece of dirt to hunt on. I was finally able to do that last year. Its mine. Nobody else is allowed.


Another thing-
I hunted with a 243 Win for quite a few years. Its a capable rifle in the hands of an accomplished marksman... but in the hands of a kid that at best is shooting 8-12" groups....not so much.
A 7mm08 is about the same recoil and a far better deer rifle. But id wager you couldnt tell this ignert ******* that.
See, this is the whole problem....you got a whole generation of assholes that cant accept the fact they might be wrong and could seriously benefit for someone elses years of knowledge and experience.
I got a dumbass nephew who is the exact same way. Never been wrong about nothing.
The best thing you can do for your own sanity is stay away from stupidity like this. Itll cost them eventually. But even then they either wont admit it or it will be someone elses fault.
 

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I think the OP handled it properly from what he says happened.

Just my opinion but While it is so very tempting to correct someone you know to be wrong, especially at the range - I think one of the worst things you can do is try to correct a Dad in front of his 9-year old son (on any topic). Ask to speak to him on the side or catch him alone away from the son and politely inform him of where/why you think his instruction is egregiously incorrect - but do Not do it in front of the son. No faster way to make someone embarrassedly defensive and closed minded in my opinion. Just me on that.

Maybe just pull out your own 30-30 and start pinging bullseyes at 100+ yards or nonchalantly say "you know, if you adjust your sights properly, this is a 100+ yd tack driver and quite the deer slayer at those distances too - I can help show you how to do it if you wish" and leave it at that. Which is what it seems the OP engaged in doing - offering to help with some sound advice and then just walking away and leaving Dad to his own device [hopefully maybe the kid picked up a little on it to try and 'experiment' with the sights on his own as he grows and is allowed to].
 

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I would of had to tell them it’s a 50 yard gun at best and offered him $100 bill for it. I’d said that I’ve seen it bounce back at 75 yards 😂 maybe followed that up with asking if his box of cartridges were more than 3 years old and say I’ve saw 5 year old box of .30-30 just go putt and smoke a lil and the bullet roll out the end of the barrel. Would you take $80 for your Marlin and old cartridges! 😂😂
 

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Thank god i have my own private range to to shoot at. Only the farmer nextdoor who helped level it and build berms around it know that the place exists. The only way to get to it is through his farm. I dont havr to put up with any unsafe idiots on public or club ranges just "Frank the farmer" who by the way teaches me stuff all the time.

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I was at the range the other day shooting a flintlock, and a guy and his young son were shooting next to me. The dad was getting his son (9 or so) ready for youth season with two different rifles, a Marlin 336c in .30-30 and a generic .243 of some sort. We got to talking, and I asked why two rifles, and was told the ".30-30 is for brush hunting, and it's only good to about 75 yards". When I asked why he thought so, he responded, "Everybody knows that!" So he proceeded to teach me by showing me the target at 50 yards. First, the kid couldn't shoot a 12" group at 50 yards from a rest, and what bullets did hit were indeed "grouped" (about 8", hard to tell with a buckshot pattern) low. Dad thought that was a result of "bullet drop", and when he shot at 100 yards, it showed twice the "drop", proving that a .30-30 is at the very extreme limit, a 75 yards gun. I explained to him to raise the sight elevator, and actually sight the gun in for 100 yards or so, and he would see remarkably less "bullet drop". Clueless, might as well been speaking Zwahili. Couldn't comprehend that the bullet wasn't dropping, it was just going where the sights were aligned. No amount of instruction or offering to help raise the rear sight was going to change his mind that the ".30-30 is at best, a 75 yard brush gun." Gun stores love ignorance like that, it keeps them selling new guns every year that are "flatter shooting". Don't even get me started with the dad and son who bought a brand new bolt rifle in .223, threw a scope on it without sighting in, and then couldn't hit a target at 12 yards (wobbling, offhand, as they left the 25 yard bench to get closer) and swore they were "going to get their money back for a defective gun!" I'm about done hunting with these kind of folks in the woods.
Maybe he had a defective scope. LOL. No the dad is just an idiot trying to teach a 9 year old how to shoot. Sounds like someone who absolutely has no knowledge of firearms, ammunition ballistics, and probably doesn't know how to sight a scope. My two 30 30 rifles would beg to differ on the 75 yards. So would this "dad", think that the 22 lr is only good to about 15 yards. I'm a fan of the 30 30 and I find this quite insulting, as do my Marlin and Winchester.
 

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I've run into this type of stuff many times while teaching Hunter Education classes. More than once while on range day, daddy would tell me I was teaching his kid wrong while on the firing line. I'm running the range. Some of these kids are shooting a gun with live ammo for the very fist time in their lives and daddy is telling me my way is wrong. Couple of times I have had to tell them that I'm teaching the approved methods of the State of Arizona which the student must learn or fail the course. If daddy kept on arguing with me I tell him the kid either learns as taught by the course of he can fail the class. That usually stops them.
When on my own at the range and see a situation like the OP's, I offer to help and ask if they have gone through the Hunter ed class? Usually I hear they want to but don't know who or where to ask. I give him the phone number of the head instructor for my group and say give him a call and tell him my name. More than once I end up having both as students. I finally dropped because of health problems something I really hated doing. I probably had as much fun teaching as the kids did learning. Some of the best 16 years of my life.
Paul B.
 

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Of course, this is all 60+ years ago, but we couldn't get a scope until we qualified as Sharpshooter or Expert on NRA targets with our iron or peep sighted .22 rifle. We had to know the basics of breathing, hold, trigger control, and follow up. It was mandatory we had to know how to make sight adjustments. Times have sure changed.

As for the .30-30 short range 'brush gun' guys, it's probably better not to argue. Last month the neighbor kid, he's 42, and I were shooting at the 200 yard berm. From 175 yards he was skipping soda pop cans with his iron sighted Winchester 1894 and 150 grain factory ammo. Pretty good shooting. Those kids still have very sharp eyes. And yes, we packed out our shot-up cans.

I would never, ever go to a public range. Too many novices and loaded guns.
 
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