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What are the differences between the 265gr FP used in the old Light Magnum® ammunition, and the current bullet used in the current Superformance™ line? I know that they added a second cannelure; the BC of .186 and SD of .205 is the same as the older bullet. Is the cannelure the only difference?
 

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A Hornady Rep that I spoke with while he was at Cabelas said that they are the same bullet. I asked him why the component bullets were so hard to come by, and his reply was that the have such a huge backlog on their production line that creating a surplus inventory of less popular bullets (i.e. the 0.430" 265 gr JFP) have taken a back seat to their more popular bullets -- hence, reduced availability.

I also asked him about the second cannelure, compared to the older bullets, which had only a single cannelure. His response to that was the lower cannelure was added to help with alignment issues created by the upper cannelure, since it is fairly close to the ogive. Occasionally, bullets would slip during the canneluring and jam up the works, so adding a second cannelure line to better stabilize the bullet during the process made more sense in the long run.

I imagine that a smoother flowing operation with less hiccups is cheaper and quality control problems would be a lot less frequent.
 

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David, I have the old and new bullets, so I went and looked. I had not even opened the box of new bullets. I see 3 differences in the new vs the old.

1. The new has 2 cannelures

2. The new has more rounded edges at the base.

3. The new measures 0.81" vs the old @ 0.80".

I weighed the 2 and as close as my scale can weigh they were both within .1 gr of 265.

So to answer your question, there are definitely differences. I wonder if they will shoot the same.

ps. You guys need to look at them side by side because the Hornady rep. is full of bull! They are definitely not the same bullet. The jacket is different, and it's possible to get the same weight they had to make it 0.01" longer.
 

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I emailed Hornady about this and was told the same as DWB:

"the second cannelure was added to keep the top one straight. They will shoot the same under the same conditions and load"

Having shot Hogs with BOTH, I can confirm that performance is the same. The first hog with older single groove, 60+- yards 47g H4198.

Second hog with dual cannelure, same load 50+- yards:
 

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I posted on a different thread that I looked at the .430" 225 gr FTX bullet and the new .430" 265 gr FN bullet. The jackets are identical. It would seem like the same jacket were used for both. Both bullets were designed for 1 in 38" twist. The bullets difference in one is a solid FN and the other is a hollow point with a monflex point place in it.
 

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Oh, sorry David, you were asking about the factory loaded information, not the differences in components...Can't help you there???
 

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Those Hornady folks telling ya'll the 2nd cannalure keeps the bullet straight just doesen't pass the smell test. I am an old phart and have earned the right to be cynical. ;)
 

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I agree that it sounds odd, but why would they come up with a story? Not to mention that that is the only answer we've got so far, and several times?
 

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VTDW said:
Those Hornady folks telling ya'll the 2nd cannalure keeps the bullet straight just doesen't pass the smell test. I am an old phart and have earned the right to be cynical. ;)
Yep, I agree. I've been to the Hornady plant several times and they have some serious technology in there. They don't need to put a guide cannelure of a bullet to keep another one straight. These folks deal with 10 thou every day, all day. They can make a straight cannelure, no sweat. If they have to put it on the .444 bullet, why don't all their bullets have it. The .430 is neither exceptionally big or exceptionally long. Just a bullet.
 

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Maybe Roan444 and I spoke with the same cat from Hornady. I know Roan mentioned he got his response via e-mail. The guy I spoke with at Cabelas just before Christmas was 5' 10', ~175 or 180#, sandy blonde hair, moustache, and was up from Grand Island for a week prior to the Christmas weekend, but I don't remember his name.

His explanation may sound odd, not pass the smell test, etc., but it does appear to be the generic answer from Hornady so far.
 

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Tony65x55 said:
Yep, I agree. I've been to the Hornady plant several times and they have some serious technology in there. They don't need to put a guide cannelure of a bullet to keep another one straight. These folks deal with 10 thou every day, all day. They can make a straight cannelure, no sweat. If they have to put it on the .444 bullet, why don't all their bullets have it. The .430 is neither exceptionally big or exceptionally long. Just a bullet.

Next time you go Tony, see if you can slip into the public relations files and see what they are trying to hide! haha, just kidding, it doesn't much matter to me, they load the same, shoot the same and most important kill the same. I can imagine the meeting they had:

CEO: "who thought it would be funny to add another groove to these bullets?"

Line manager: "well, joe was late for work this morning, so I took the start of his shift, but couldn't remember where we set the groover, so I thought I'd just let the public reloader figure out how deep to set them."

CEO: "well were getting hammered with questions about that whole thing, so just come up wit a story about not being able to keep the top one straight!"

Line mgr: "do you really think they will buy that?"

CEO: "Most of them will, but there are some really sharp guys at Marlinowners that might not, but put it out there anyway"

Line Mgr: "OK"
 

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Truthfully, I don't care why they did it. They put 2 cannelures in the 300 gr XTP. I thought it was there so you could load the 265 gr into the shorter LE brass. But since I don't, it doesn't matter. The one change that bothered me slightly was the difference in length, but I think it's necessary to get the same weight with the different jacket. The only thing I'm interested in is that it shoots to the same POI and that it performs the same on game. I know there are some even older 265's that were slightly different from the ones we were now using. I had some of them, as well. They had a slightly different nose and different looking skives in the jacket. But they shot the same.
 

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I did a lot of measuring and comparing last night. Lots of similarities/exactly the same measurements but there are a few differences.

The avg OAL of the new 265 gr FP is .804 and the old is .800. As pointed out above the base of the new is more rounded than the old. On the new from the base to the start of the ogive is .460 avg. AND the ogive starts in the top cannelure!!! The old ones have a distance of approx .510 from the base to the top of the shoulder (above the cannelure and the shoulder is .060 from the top of the cannelure to the top of the shoulder). At that point the ogive begins. To me it seems like quite a bit of difference but I won't know until I load up some new ones. It could be interesting but not a drastic difference but we shall see eh? ;)

Dave 8)
 

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Re: Hornady® 265gr FP Bullet Differences?

VTDW said:
I did a lot of measuring and comparing last night. Lots of similarities/exactly the same measurements but there are a few differences.

The avg OAL of the new 265 gr FP is .804 and the old is .800. As pointed out above the base of the new is more rounded than the old. On the new from the base to the start of the ogive is .460 avg. AND the ogive starts in the top cannelure!!! The old ones have a distance of approx .510 from the base to the top of the shoulder (above the cannelure and the shoulder is .060 from the top of the cannelure to the top of the shoulder). At that point the ogive begins. To me it seems like quite a bit of difference but I won't know until I load up some new ones. It could be interesting but not a drastic difference but we shall see eh? ;)

Dave 8)
This is interesting and some precision measuring. Do you have the HDY .430" 225 gr.FTX. bullet to measure. I think the 225 gr. and the 265 gr. FN. share the same jack and same manufacturing setup. It make sense to me that Hornady would do this. Why have two different setup when one would do the same for two.

Halwg said:
The only thing I'm interested in is that it shoots to the same POI and that it performs the same on game.
And I agree with Halwg

TO NY
 

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VTDW said:
I did a lot of measuring and comparing last night. Lots of similarities/exactly the same measurements but there are a few differences.

The avg OAL of the new 265 gr FP is .804 and the old is .800. As pointed out above the base of the new is more rounded than the old. On the new from the base to the start of the ogive is .460 avg. AND the ogive starts in the top cannelure!!! The old ones have a distance of approx .510 from the base to the top of the shoulder (above the cannelure and the shoulder is .060 from the top of the cannelure to the top of the shoulder). At that point the ogive begins. To me it seems like quite a bit of difference but I won't know until I load up some new ones. It could be interesting but not a drastic difference but we shall see eh? ;)

Dave 8)
Dave, you did a lot more measurements than I did, but I got a little more of a difference in OAL than you. Your micrometer may be more accurate than mine. But even to the naked eye it is obvious that the bullet has changed significantly over the old version. New & Improved? Well, I guess we'll have to wait until someone tests them either at the range or on game to find out.
 

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308/338 said:
This is interesting and some precision measuring. Do you have the HDY .430" 225 gr.FTX. bullet to measure. I think the 225 gr. and the 265 gr. share the same jack and same manufacturing setup. It make sense to me that Hornady would do this. Why have two different setup when one would do the same for two.
And I agree with Halwg

TO NY
No, I do not have any of the 225 gr FTX bullets and I too agree with Hal.

Dave 8)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Halwg said:
Dave, you did a lot more measurements than I did, but I got a little more of a difference in OAL than you. Your micrometer may be more accurate than mine. But even to the naked eye it is obvious that the bullet has changed significantly over the old version. New & Improved? Well, I guess we'll have to wait until someone tests them either at the range or on game to find out.
As soon as they hit store shelves here I'll get some. Will be interested to see how they "print" in my two rifles. Right now both are dead on zeroed @ 150yds with the discontinued Hornady® Light Magnum™ loading.
 
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