Marlin Firearms Forum banner
1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,327 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
From: American Rifleman



By Mark Keefe


There is a reason why American Rifleman‘s print edition does not review guns until they are fully in production. Often manufacturers give us the first look at any new firearm. We are invited to seminars and range events where such guns make their debut. But as a matter of policy we do not put guns into the magazine until they are fully in production.

I see no reason to tell 2.2 million readers in detail about a firearm that cannot even be ordered. The Remington R51 pistol was introduced earlier this year. It is a very interesting pistol that utilizes the original John D. Pedersen hesitation lock from the Model 51 of the last century. A group of writers including Feld Editor Wiley Clapp attended an event at Gunsite where they encountered few issues with the gun. All in all, the pre-production R51 pistols worked very well, about as well as you would expect for any new design. The problem came as the gun went from small pre-production to mass production. There are number of reports from consumers and evaluators about issues with the full production version of the gun.

Today Remington announced that R51 pistols that are out there can be sent back for a replacement from new production slated to start in a couple of months.

The R51, according to Remington, will enter production again in October. Those who have an R51 can send it back to Remington and will be supplied with a new R51, two magazines and a Pelican case for their trouble.

The full text of Remington’s announcement is as follows:
“Earlier this year, we launched the innovative R51 subcompact pistol to critical acclaim. During testing, numerous experts found the pistol to function flawlessly. In fact, they found it to have lower felt recoil, lower muzzle rise and better accuracy and concealability than other products in its class.
However, after initial commercial sales, our loyal customers notified us that some R51 pistols had performance issues. We immediately ceased production to re-test the product. While we determined the pistols were safe, certain units did not meet Remington’s performance criteria. The performance problems resulted from complications during our transition from prototype to mass production. These problems have been identified and solutions are being implemented, with an expected production restart in October.
Anyone who purchased an R51 may return it and receive a new R51 pistol, along with two additional magazines and a custom Pelican case, by calling Remington at (800) 243-9700.
The new R51 will be of the same exceptional quality as our test pistols, which performed flawlessly.



I'll pass, thank you very much.

Roe
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
16,009 Posts
Me too! Typical FG crap IMHO...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,077 Posts
If Remington get enough bad publicity maybe they will put more quality in their product. Lets all hope so. Nice thread thanks for sharing with us.

Enjoy the Journey
444GS2
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,429 Posts
The whole pistol reminds me of the "new browning a 5", the only thing common to the original A5 in the name.

The original 51 was a very unique pistol, designed by a man that does not get near the credit deserved for a lot of gun designs. Not all of them from Rem.

But it was expensive to build even then, and had a short life.

Like many things today, Q C issues at the production level, seems the drag on getting more recent gun designs into production.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,128 Posts
I've seen a lot of problems in recent manufacture pistols, in my firearms classes the past couple of years:

Walther
Kahr
Kimber Solo

All of them really gave their owners grief. I wonder if the manufacturers are just putting too much emphasis on quantity, rather than quality?

These were all expensive pistols too... The owners expected, rightfully, more...

Guy
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,126 Posts
No way I will ever own one after watching the video T-Roy posted. I can't believe that Remington put that gun out there for sale. Do they not have a range and someone to shoot all day long. Maybe everyone they had testing the guns are out of fingers.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,128 Posts
I guess i should throw away the antlers on the wall that I took using Remingtons?

Or the medals and trophies I won at matches here in the U.S. and in Canada? Shooting a Remington rifle? :biggrin:
 

·
Contributing Member
Joined
·
11,599 Posts
I have my grandpa's old Remington Sportsman 20ga semi-auto and it sure ain't going in the garbage. But, right now I have no desire to promote the company. The last straw for me was a Remington made Bushmaster that the bolt siezed up on so hard and in such an odd position I have no idea how that fella dealt with it. Just one of many personal encounters with Remington issues over the past couple years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,368 Posts
I hate defending Remington because I really feel they have caused me a lot of grief
that would not have happened if their QC was better.
That said ramping up production can be costly and a huge Pain if the production line
has problems.
The R51 could very well be a decent gun, BUT they should not have introduced it
until the production run had all the bugs worked out of it.
Remington quality has severely dropped over the past decade and I doubt very much
that I will buy a new Remington until I am convinced that they are focusing on
quality over quantity.
I am not holding my breath.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
11,160 Posts
“Earlier this year, we launched the innovative R51 subcompact pistol to critical acclaim. During testing, numerous experts found the pistol to function flawlessly. In fact, they found it to have lower felt recoil, lower muzzle rise and better accuracy and concealability than other products in its class.
However, after initial commercial sales, our loyal customers notified us that some R51 pistols had performance issues. We immediately ceased production to re-test the product. While we determined the pistols were safe, certain units did not meet Remington’s performance criteria. The performance problems resulted from complications during our transition from prototype to mass production. These problems have been identified and solutions are being implemented, with an expected production restart in October.

Anyone who purchased an R51 may return it and receive a new R51 pistol, along with two additional magazines and a custom Pelican case, by calling Remington at (800) 243-9700.
The new R51 will be of the same exceptional quality as our test pistols, which performed flawlessly.



Pure FGI "Spin" at its best..............................

At this point in the game, the R51 has ALREADY gained an unfavorable reputation in the Market place..........FGI is now trying to regain their developement costs with that "Spin"

NO THANKS!...................Anything remington or FGI, and I'll pass.............

Tom

 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
25,165 Posts
When my Rem Model 700 gets back from the warranty repair shop--I have a co-worker ready to buy it. I will stick with new Savage rifles if I need to take a bolt gun to the field.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,327 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I just find it sad...heartbreaking actually. The damage FGI's corporate policies and mismanagement has done to two of our oldest firearms manufacturers, both who had a long and envious track record of well designed, well built, and affordable products, borders on criminal.

I have a number of Remington rifles and shotguns made well before FGI. The four Model 700 bolt actions I have are some of the most accurate of any of my rifles, the 11-87 and 870 shotguns have given many years of flawless performance, the vintage Model 8, Model 141, and rimfire 550's are fine examples of the art of gunmaking, and my custom 700 bear gun has become an veritable extension of myself.

I would not give these up, nor hide them away, do to the lack of foresight of the executives of a holding company, just as I won't disparage the vintage Marlins I own because of the poor quality of current production, due to that same lack of direction. Instead, I will cherish those Remingtons, just as I do the Marlins, glad I am able to serve as their caretaker for whatever short peroid of time that may prove to be.

As it is with Marlin, Remington is not a dirty word in my household. However, as long as they are owned by FGI, I will avoid their products like the plague and continue to hold their feet to the fire for the tremendous disservice to shooters and sportsmen they are undeniably guilty of.

Roe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
This is the best gun I own... a Remington. It seems to be a masterpiece of fit and finish, an absolute gorgeous thing to look at. It is dead on accurate and goes bang every time the trigger is pulled.



This is my other Remington. I've owned this one for 64 years. It also goes bang every time.



While I know Rem. has suffered from quality issues lately and I would never buy a Remlin. I am proud of the two Remingtons I have.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
450 Posts
I like my Remingtons; Model 700ADL 30/06 that is my spare on any big game hunt. I put it in a Bell & Carlson BDL stock with a Quick Klip conversion adjusted the trigger to a nice 3.5 Lbs and have loaned it out a few times as well. Can't say enough about my 1100 12ga. but I can't hit a thing with the 20ga LT. (it just doesn't fit me) Had my dads 16ga Sportsman Auito 5 clone for years, loned it to an uncle and it got stolen. I don't have any of the FGI guns but I always look a gun over very closely before I buy one and if the price was right and the quality appeared to be there as well I wouldn't hesitate if it was something I was looking for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,429 Posts
The "new" Remington is a mirror of way too many American manufacturing company's in general. It's a mirror of the education system, it mirrors union labor issues, it mirrors nearly all of the problems that have been building for decades, and the chickens are
coming home to roost , all in a period of a few years.

Had a buddy worked in the GM plants in KC back in the late 70s. Used to tell about workers throwing a couple of washers into doors to rattle around. and they wondered later as too why Toyota began being the car of choice across America.

Same deal with Rem, and a crock pot full of others in this country.

A bunch of the neck tie wearing jack wads, need to go to jail. It would not cure every issue of course but like the bus load of lawyers going over the cliff, "it's a good start"

As far as introducing a new gun into a production line, it's oft fraught with problems. But it's obvious some one at Rem is simply violating the puppy, and has been for a long time, and management does not seem to care.

All we can do is vote with our dollars.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,295 Posts
DDDWho I also own a Remington 514 that I bought in Guthrie Oklahoma for around 18.00 dollars new in 1966. The most accurate 22 I own. Too bad they still can't make them like that..
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top