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Discussion Starter #1
I want to purchase a Marlin 444 to shoot 250 to 280 grain hard cast bullets. I know that over the years, the twist rate has changed. What year of manufactor produced a good twist rate to shoot 250 to 280 grain hard cast bullets?
 

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All of my factory Marlins are the slow 1-38 Microgroove rifling, they are more difficult to get that
perfect load, when you do get that perfect load it will be just as accurate as the 1-20, but it will also be faster. That to me is the Holy Grail for handloading any hunting rifle. The 1-38 MG will handle all jacketed bullets and it will shoot hardcast bullets up to 360grs accurately if your barrel is broken in/firelapped and the bullets are sized right and of the correct hardness and you know the 1-38 MG 444Mantra: " Velocity is your friend"
 

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Mine has a 1-20 twist. When I shoot lead bullets, I use Laser Cast bullets. They have a gas check and lead hardness of BN22 and are 310 gr. They shoot just fine.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I have a Marlin 30-30. If I get it rebored to 375 or 444, what twist rate would be the best for cast bullets?
 

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My MG handles 265 FN Hornady bullets like a target rifle. There are lots of reviews that report strong performance up to the mid 300 range from very credible sources.

In your weight range, same as mine, you can expect superb performance. Early 444s have a reputation for accuracy and I now believe that has a lot to do with MG and the easy twist torque from the 1-38" barrel.

I am just gearing up to cast but the formula is always the same. Slug your barrel and throat to KNOW your sizes. Fill the throat not the barrel, most report .432 as a good start. Good articles below.
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/444_misunderstood.htm
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/444.htm
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/fryxell/444marlin.htm
http://www.ranchdogoutdoors.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_5_11
http://www.firearmssite.com/444_marlin.htm
 

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Taylor said:
I have a Marlin 30-30. If I get it rebored to 375 or 444, what twist rate would be the best for cast bullets?
I am guessing you mean barreled or can you bore out a 30-30 to something that large and still have meat on the barrel ? I also did not know the action and everything else would be able to take that much more from the big bores. Have you looked into it and the costs ? Just curious .
 

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Canuck Bob said:
My MG handles 265 FN Hornady bullets like a target rifle. There are lots of reviews that report strong performance up to the mid 300 range from very credible sources.

In your weight range, same as mine, you can expect superb performance. Early 444s have a reputation for accuracy and I now believe that has a lot to do with MG and the easy twist torque from the 1-38" barrel.

I am just gearing up to cast but the formula is always the same. Slug your barrel and throat to KNOW your sizes. Fill the throat not the barrel, most report .432 as a good start. Good articles below.
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/444_misunderstood.htm
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/444.htm
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/fryxell/444marlin.htm
http://www.ranchdogoutdoors.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_5_11
http://www.firearmssite.com/444_marlin.htm
The first article I ever read by Paco was "444 Misunderstood" judging by this article he does not understand it very well so at least the title is accurate. I have heard he has quite a following. It really makes me wonder.

Instead of reading what Paco says, spend some time on Cast Boolits and you will know more than him in a couple hours.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
http://www.35caliber.com/3.html

Jesse Ocumpaugh rebores 30-30s to several different calibers. He charges $250 give or take a little depending on the type of rifling and the number of groves you want.

I thought the articules were very interesting. Thanks.
 

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Taylor, I just reread both the articles by Paco and must disagree with RIH. I've been using mine since 1975 and reloading as well. He talks about jacketed bullets mainly but does not write anything I take exception with. I am quite happy with the 265 Hornady myself. He debunks the myth about the slow twist not handling heavy bullets per your question.

The three article series on the 444 on the Beartooth Bullet site are highly recommended. I loaded you up with lots of links and thought another 3 was too much!
 

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Paco'e writing style is a tad convoluted, but spot on! I had a 38-55 rebored by Jesse to 444 with a 1-15 twist, it shoots really good accuracy wise, but not great, my intent with the 1-15 twist was to shoot only hardcast bullets from 350grs on up, at any velocity accurately.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I have given it a lot of thought and I have decided to go after an older model with a 24 inch barrel, so it will be a 1 in 38 twist. I want to shot either a 265 grain hard cast bullet or Hornady's 265 grain jacketed bullet. I want to do some black bear hunting this fall. I have a Marlin in 30-30, a 35 Remington Marlin, and a 308 Browning. I have killed deer with the 30-30, but I am not confident with bear or large hogs. The 35 and 308 do well on deer, but I want something that will put a bear on its back since I hunt from the ground. There are a couple large gun shows coming up in September. I will trade the 30-30.
 

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The 444 is a superb game rifle. It handles large blacks with real authority. It shines with black bear and moose. Your bullet choices will be fine. If you want to try some heavy bullets a bunch of guys here like the Beartooth 295 grainer. Personally I just ordered a cast mold for 270 grains solid or 250 grains HP.

Edit: Dawei has pointed out correctly that the Beartooth bullet is a 290 Gr. Thanks D.
 

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Canuck Bob said:
The 444 is a superb game rifle. It handles large blacks with real authority. It shines with black bear and moose. Your bullet choices will be fine. If you want to try some heavy bullets a bunch of guys here like the Beartooth 295 grainer. Personally I just ordered a cast mold for 270 grains solid or 250 grains HP.
Bob - FWIW the Beartooth® 290gr LFNGC Cast Boolits that I have weigh 296gr. I further know that Beartooth® lists the following weights for their 44 cal boolits: 240, 250, 260, 265, 280, 290, 300, 325, 330, 355, and 405gr.
 

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Taylor said:
http://www.35caliber.com/3.html

Jesse Ocumpaugh rebores 30-30s to several different calibers. He charges $250 give or take a little depending on the type of rifling and the number of groves you want.

I thought the articules were very interesting. Thanks.
$175 including return shipping
 
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