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I recently picked up a well used 336 30-30 at a pawn shop for a good price. After a quick cleaning by running a few wet patches with #9 and a few dry patches I installed a Weaver V-10 and took'er for a shoot. Groups were ok, around 2moa with Win 170gr. But when I got back home and started to seriously clean it, it seems that no ammount of brushing and scrubbing will get the bore clean. Each time I brush the bore, no matter what cleaning product I use, the patches I run through after brushing come out "black and gooey"....I've soaked the bore overnite in Break-free and Kroil with no great results.
In over thirtyfive years of shooting, reloading and cleaning all types of firearms, including serving as a weapons maintenance officer for an N.C. prison unit, I've never seen a gun that could'nt be cleaned. This one has me stumped. I have worn out a .30 cal bronze brush and used over 50 patches on this rifle and they still comes out black....Am I missing something?????.....Later,B.
 

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I don't have an answer , but I hope some one else does. I have run into the same thing a few times. After many scrubs , and more, I'd wipe it dry and just go from there. Tried all kinds of things even some kitchen type cleaners, careful about the blueing though. Nothing worked at times. I thought that maybe the cleaner or oil mix was just changing the color. (?) Idon't know. But I sure hope someone does ......MUTT
 

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BDavis said:
I recently picked up a well used 336 30-30 at a pawn shop for a good price. After a quick cleaning by running a few wet patches with #9 and a few dry patches I installed a Weaver V-10 and took'er for a shoot. Groups were ok, around 2moa with Win 170gr. But when I got back home and started to seriously clean it, it seems that no ammount of brushing and scrubbing will get the bore clean. Each time I brush the bore, no matter what cleaning product I use, the patches I run through after brushing come out "black and gooey"....I've soaked the bore overnite in Break-free and Kroil with no great results.
In over thirtyfive years of shooting, reloading and cleaning all types of firearms, including serving as a weapons maintenance officer for an N.C. prison unit, I've never seen a gun that could'nt be cleaned. This one has me stumped. I have worn out a .30 cal bronze brush and used over 50 patches on this rifle and they still comes out black....Am I missing something?????.....Later,B.
SOunds like to me that you've made a good start on cleaning the bore. :) I have had rifle bores that took me days to get clean, and one surplus Mauser I encountered took a solid 2 weeks of daily scrubbing and soaking. Amazingly, once that barrel was finally clean it proved to be pristine and a wonderful shooter.

It would probably shock and amaze us rifle lovers to discover how many rifles, no matter how old and well-used, are NEVER cleaned, and just as surprising how many barrels of "so-so" accuracy become tack drivers once they get the attention they need. But we need to realize that if that rifle's missed 100 thorough cleanings it'll probably take that many to get it clean!
 

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Hey B,

How does the bore look inside? Does it look flat or shiny? Any spotting?

How about running some old 'scotch bright' a few times or whatever that kind of material is called... Might just help. Hopefully someone will have a better idea.

Mad
 

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If it is lead, mix 50%hydrogen peroxide and 50 % white vinigar, will disolve lead like no ones business. Put a small cork in the barrel (or other suitable plug) leave no more than 15 minutes and pour out. Then pour hot, close to boiling water down the barrel. This stops any further chemical action. Then clean as normal. I had a barrel plugged with lead that when I pushed a fishing weight through to measure the barrel there were no lands and groves, no not one of mine, two of the above actions had it shooting again and clean as could be.
 

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Have you tried any of the Foaming bore cleaners?

I have used them in the past and they seem dissolve a lot of junk.
 

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i would try the peroxide solution..... and just keep on cleaning. i have used about that many patches to clean my M4 after an afternoon at the range, and i know the barrell was clean before hand as nobody in my unit cleans my weapons but me. good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thanks for the replies and advice.....The bore looks clean to the naked eye but patches still come out nasty.....I don't see any lead flakes after brushing so I'm thinking it's just dirty. I'd like to try one of the foam cleaners if I can find some localy......Later,B.
 

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What's worked best for me on really dirty bores is to wet the bore down real good with Hoppe's No. 9 and let set overnight. Next day, wipe it out with a dry patch or two. Then wet it down again with Hoppe's No. 9 and let it sit overnight. Repeat this procedure every day until there's no more mung left in the bore. Takes seven or eight days sometimes. After you get it real clean one time it is easier to keep clean from then on.

I find I can run patch after patch after brush after patch through a bore for hours on end and the bore will NEVER come clean. But, if I just let the Hoppe's sit and do it's thing, the solvent does all the work over time and I don't have to waste as much effort trying to scrub the filth out.

You can leave Hoppe's in the bore as long as you need to and not worry about it damaging anything like the more aggressive solvents might. It will dissolve copper, lead, carbon, plastic, everything. You just have to give it time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I wish I knew how to post pix so you could see whats comming out of this barrel. Someday soon I'll get my 13 y/o daughter to show me how.
I seriously doubt this rifle was ever cleaned since it was new in 1978. I'm gonna try the overnite soak with #9 for a few nites and see if things improve. I feel stupid to keep bringing this subject up but I have cleaned a bunch of firearms over the years for family/friends and at work but I aint seen nothing like this. I almost feel like I'm on a quest now to find out what it takes to remove 28 years of rifle neglect.
As a side note, has anyone tried the Outers Foul Out system. It was all the rage in the gun rags a few years back but I don't recall seeing anything about it lately.
Thanks to all......Later,B.
 

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Cleaning a M-28 Mosin Nagant

BDavis,

I am sincere when I tell you to buy a can of foaming bore cleaner.

I am using WipeOut right now on a MilSurp barrel that was put together in 1928. I have never seen a barrel as badly fouled with carbon and copper as this one. Every night for the last five nights I have been filling the barrel with foam and waiting 24 hours. The first two nights the cleaning cloths came out black. This is indicative of powder fouling. Mind you this was after cleaning and brushing with Hoppes #9 repeatedly. Now, for the last three nights the cloths have been coming out Royal Blue. After I run a few dry cloths through it to dry it out, there is still gray streaking on the cloths. A visual through the bore and I can still see what looks like miniscule flaking in the barrel. I am hoping and guessing that this is more copper fouling.

If you read through the WipeOut website you will read of cases where the copper and powder fouling was layered, requiring many treatments. I sure hope that when I get through this copper layer I don’t find more powder fouling!

Up to now I have used WipeOut to clean my AR-15, 336 and Remington Model 700 barrels. One treatment was all I needed to get rid of all traces of copper. Plus you avoid the wear from repeated use of bronze brushes. This milsurp barrel I am now cleaning is a whole new level of cleaning for me.

I am suggesting that you try any of the foaming cleaners as a starting point. I hope you will be impressed. I am only suggesting WipeOut because at this point it is all I have tried.

I ordered mine from Midway, but here is the WipeOut site: http://www.paulcompany.com/

Hey, would another BDavis steer you wrong?

Good Luck,
Brad Davis
 

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The best luck I've had on getting a bore like this clean is to use the JB Bore Cleaner Kit from Brownells. Just follow the directions on the containers and you will get it clean in no time at all.

I then treat the bore with Militec-1 and then clean it normally with Hoppes # 9 followed by Militec-1 again. Once in a while I'll use Sweets 762 to get any remaining copper.

I know at least a couple of gunsmiths that use exactly the same thing when they clean up a rifle..... :D :D YMMV
 
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