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220px-P.O._Ackley.jpg PO Ackley was using the 17 javelina on deer goats and he even killed a black bear with one shot! I do not claim a 17 in any form is a deer cartridge! but I have showed the photos of the one my friend killed last year with his 17 rem. what prompted me to have him do the experiment was a gunsmith friend of mine told me several years ago he use to kill off does with his 17 rem. when I said did you shoot them in the neck he said no I shoot them in the shoulder! he said every one he shot "and there were several" he said was like a light switch was cut off, instant death! now the deer my friend shot with his 17 did hop off 40 or 50yds but it was shot behind the shoulder. we just measured the shot last week and it was 112yds,,,,,,,,,,,,
 

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I had said I like to keep to 100gr + on body shots because some like to use ballistic tips. I used a 70 or 75 gr Nosler ballistic tip from my 243 on a deer once. It killed it quickly and didn't run 50yds. The bullet came all to pieces and had shrapnel everywhere, even the on side shoulder was bloodshot. I hit it behind the shoulder for heart/lung shot. I've killed a bunch of deer with the 243 because it was my only deer rifle until I got into Marlins. If the Nosler would have been a solid expansion bullet, I would have killed it just as easily without having extra metal in the meat.

I've made the scapula shot (high shoulder) many times and turned out the lights so quickly I didn't see them fall. I hunt for meat and sometimes don't want to be tracking when I could be skinning. I've shot em in the head with a 17HMR and head/neck with the 243. My son's first deer was with the 243 at the base of the skull.

I know my limitations and where to quickly kill a deer with a certain shot. I wouldn't want to give anyone who doesn't have the experience the wrong idea about using a small round in the wrong spot on a deer.
 

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The point is 22 cal rifles are not for beginners, especially in the woods. We have already establishes you can kill deer with a 22 RF.
That is not the point. Poachers Pet is a 22, they shoot close range at Jack lighted deer. Stationary head shots, it's dead. I have shot
a lot of deer on damage permits with Varmit guns with 10x to 16x scopes. It's no problem to head shoot deer off a rest. The way l
hunt deer a 22CF rifle would be my last choice because they are going to be body shots at running deer. I have seen many deer
shot with larger caliber rifles that are poor hits that require tracking.
 

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I had said I like to keep to 100gr + on body shots because some like to use ballistic tips. I used a 70 or 75 gr Nosler ballistic tip from my 243 on a deer once. It killed it quickly and didn't run 50yds. The bullet came all to pieces and had shrapnel everywhere, even the on side shoulder was bloodshot. I hit it behind the shoulder for heart/lung shot. I've killed a bunch of deer with the 243 because it was my only deer rifle until I got into Marlins. If the Nosler would have been a solid expansion bullet, I would have killed it just as easily without having extra metal in the meat.

I've made the scapula shot (high shoulder) many times and turned out the lights so quickly I didn't see them fall. I hunt for meat and sometimes don't want to be tracking when I could be skinning. I've shot em in the head with a 17HMR and head/neck with the 243. My son's first deer was with the 243 at the base of the skull.

I know my limitations and where to quickly kill a deer with a certain shot. I wouldn't want to give anyone who doesn't have the experience the wrong idea about using a small round in the wrong spot on a deer.

A 223 with a 55gr Barnes TTSX will typically punch through both shoulder and exit at ranges under 150yds.


Bullet weight doesn't matter as much as bullet construction, as you found out using a varmint bullet at high speeds on a deer.

The 95gr Ballistic Tip is constructed much tougher because it's in the Nosler Hunting line of BT's. I've used them on deer and every one has exited.
 

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The .223 suffers from the same malady as the .243 in that it makes a fine varmint round. Both work very well for deer, but in that application, you have to leave the varmint bullets at home and use projectiles of proper construction and they have to be put in the right place.

Virginia does not yet allow the .223 for deer hunting, but I intend on trying out my .458 SOCOM this year. I don't think the good Commonwealth can argue with a 300 grain Hornady HP at 1800 fps.
 

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A .243 is usually my first choice for deer hunting. If not a .243, I will hunt with one of my .30-30's, or my .270, .308 or .30-06. I try to take each of my rifles out at least once during deer season; including my AR. I load my AR with 70 grain Speer SP over H335. The stands I hunt from offer about 100 yards maximum range. Plenty of evidence to support the use of .223 for deer. Using the proper bullet and putting that bullet in the right spot is always the key. On the other hand; if you don't feel confident that a .223 will do the job for you, it's probably best not to use it.
 

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Bearcat, the 95 BT became my mostest favorite deer bullet in the .243. I can't say anything bad about it. I've had them punch through even at short distance, the acid test of bullet integrity.

I do like the 95 NBT from my 243's. It's super accurate from all 3 of mine and performance has been excellent on critters but it's hard for me to leave the 80TTSX alone. They're running around 3300fps and they've punched through from all angles even on close shots.


That 70gr Speer is accurate as all get out from my .223's with H4895 but I've never used them on deer. I worked up a load with them but never put it to use.


I hunt in close and in the thick stuff so I'm a shoulder shooter, either one or both depending on the angle, and I've not found the small cal's lacking with the right bullets. As to the shot placement comments, whatever legal chambering I'm carrying in no way impacts where I'm going to hit an animal. I'm not taking a head or neck shot with anything on purpose because I'll have enough bullet to hit'm in the shoulders without worry whether it's my .223, 45/70 or anything in between.

And as was mentioned above, if you're not comfortable with it then don't use it.
 

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An AR in .223/5.56 is an adequate, and can be a fantastic combo for smaller frame deer. Here in AL, the average doe is 90-120 pounds tops. I have taken many deer with an AR with Winchester 64gr. Power point bullets. If hit in the shoulder areas, the deer are usually DRT with a fist size exit wound. A head shot is also one of my preferred shots on does.
 

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Legal here in NC but then again so is the .22 short for whitetails. Only restriction is no full auto. State lets the hunter decide. I've killed three whitetails with Sierra 77gr Matchkings out of my 14.5' AR15 (can hunt with SBRs too but mine is pinned and weld to 16") That bullet works on the most dangerous animal on the planet. Going to take my 10 yr grandson with his AR15 next month hopefully if I don't go back to Astan. Pick a suitable bullet for the task and twist of your rifle and put it where it needs to. I've also carried Win 64 gr PSP but haven't gotten a deer to act as the target yet. Picked up some Fed 62gr Fusion also to try.

CD
 

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Legal here in NC but then again so is the .22 short for whitetails. Only restriction is no full auto. State lets the hunter decide. I

How refreshing, the state let's the hunter decide.

Thanks and you be careful if they send you back. Always seemed too much like Nam.....No idea who is your friend and who wants to kill you.

Padraig
 

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Anyone use a 5.56/.223 AR for deer. Concidering throwing mine in the mix for deer season just for fun. Not as a primary rifle but take it out a couple of times
5.56/223 with 55 grn is the minimum you can hunt with here in Hawaii. The minimum is 1200 ft lbs of energy which this just makes. If you want to use your AR just swap the upper for a 6.5 Grendel or a 6.8 SPC. Or you can use a 450 Bushmaster upper all of which will work on a Std A2 Lower.
 

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I am building an AR in .277 Wolverine at present. It is a wildcat that necks up a 223 casing to 6.8mm bullets. Used in standard AR platform with all components the same except barrel. Pushes a 110gr Accubond at around 2600fps! Great for deer and hogs in my neck of the woods and just something different!
The only limit is the case size. You could just use a 300BLK and get a 30cal on the same shell. On a 6.5 Grendel the case is fatter and holds more powder but still fits in the magazine. Same for 6.8 SPC. The 450 bushmaster is the same as using a 45-70 and it kicks the same. The 450 BM is still built on the Std AR but I use an upper that is made for the larger rounds as they open up the ejection port so the larger shells can eject freely. The mud cover still locks in place and covers the port. I can tell you that for some reason the 450 Bushmaster is very accurate out to 100 yrds (I typically get 3 shot grps that are half dollar size).
 

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I have with a group training in the Rocky Mountains. We had to supplement our rations but only had 556 scoped and other weapons where,,,, well overkill. (Think hunting with a 50BMG, a mess. But with such a light round in full metal jacket you have to be sure of a kill shot. Some say 556 was adopted as the NATO light personal weapon was more ammo carried and the Full metal Jacket was from the Geneva convention to do minimal damage to remove a person from the battlefield and 4 others to help evac. I can’t confirm that (without googling it, and I’m lazy) but the 556 in FMG poorly aimed will cause a dear to bolt and suffer with a slow death. I’m sure non FMG like hollow points would make it more damaging but why risk it. Unless you have no other larger calibers. Additionally the effective range is 300 yards but 200 is more ideal for accuracy after that the round tumbles.
 
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