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Discussion Starter #1
I've been thinking about building/changing an 1894 to accept the 460 Rowland cartridge. I've found a gunsmith who is experienced with 1894s and really wants to do the work. I have an 1894 in 44 mag that will be the base for the build. I'm leaning toward an quick handling 16 inch barrel gun; essentially a truck/saddle gun. Any thoughts or recommendations? All good ideas appreciated:questionmark:
 

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I'm having one built right now. But instead of the chambering being reamed for 460 rowland it is reamed for 45 acp. Then I will trim 460 rowland brass and load it to 460 rowland spec. This way I can still shoot 45 acp,+p, 45 super, and my modified 460 rowland cartridge.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
We're working with the same gunsmith. How long is your barrel and what is twist rate?
I'm having one built right now. But instead of the chambering being reamed for 460 rowland it is reamed for 45 acp. Then I will trim 460 rowland brass and load it to 460 rowland spec. This way I can still shoot 45 acp,+p, 45 super, and my modified 460 rowland cartridge.
 

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By cutting 2 inches of I can fit 11 short round or 10 long rounds. I believe Douglas was doing a 1 in 16. I'm thinking I'll be able to push a 280 grain bullet around 1450 fps or 200 grain bullet 1750 fps.
 

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I like this conversion. I have a 45 ACP/45 super Handi rifle with an 18.5" barrel. I have chronied 200 grain xtp factory ammo at 1500 fps, so your 1750 sounds about right for the rowland. I am curious what modifications, if any, are nessicary to make the rifle cycle correctly.

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Reworking the carrier and extractor. Also either setting the barrel back or rebarreling. Mine is also being short stroked and have no idea what that entails. As soon as I receive I will post info about it and maybe a video or two. Maybe RPP will do a little advertising on it as well.

200 grain xtp at acp level? Or +p? Or Super?
 

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Sound interesting. What's the advantage over .45 Colt?
 

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Sound interesting. What's the advantage over .45 Colt?
None other than capacity. But then again I can't shoot 45 Colt in my 460 rowland pistol. :) Honestly, I believe the 45 Colt to be the finest pistol cartridge in a rifle!

But if I really would be on that page I may as well stick with my 45-70 that can do it all.

I guess ammo would be cheaper to shoot and my kids and the rest of my family will love shooting this gun. Whenever I can buy a gun to bring the family together is a good enough reason for me to pull the trigger on one so to speak.
 
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Discussion Starter #9
The 460 Rowland has a stronger case and more capacity. In a handgun you get between 300 and 600 FPS more out of the muzzle. Compared to a 44 magnum, you get a bigger bullet moving faster and it chambers in a 1911 frame. The stronger case also allows the use of faster burning powders; obviously other considerations here.
Sound interesting. What's the advantage over .45 Colt?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I think short stroke is reducing the lever travel for faster cycling.
Reworking the carrier and extractor. Also either setting the barrel back or rebarreling. Mine is also being short stroked and have no idea what that entails. As soon as I receive I will post info about it and maybe a video or two. Maybe RPP will do a little advertising on it as well.

200 grain xtp at acp level? Or +p? Or Super?
 

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The 45 Colt in a proper built gun will always have it over the 460 rowland. It can use heqvier bullets the 460 could never seat. More powder to get it moving faster especially in a rifle. But a 280 grain bullet moving at the velocity I believe I can get it to is more than enough for anything on this continent.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I can shoot a variety of length rounds out of the 45-70. I believe the difference between a "Hornady Leverevolution - Govt Round" is greater than the difference between the "45 ACP - 460 Rowland" round. So, why couldn't I have the chamber reamed for the 460 Rowland and still be able to shoot the 45 ACP? Good discussion!
I'm having one built right now. But instead of the chambering being reamed for 460 rowland it is reamed for 45 acp. Then I will trim 460 rowland brass and load it to 460 rowland spec. This way I can still shoot 45 acp,+p, 45 super, and my modified 460 rowland cartridge.
 

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Because it head spaces on the case mouth in the acp and rowland rounds. Using a 45 acp round in a 460 rowland chamber requires the the 45 acp to head space on the extractor that will be pretty tough on an extractor and won't get great accuracy that way. Also if there is a little too much slop between the extractor and rim the cartridge may be pushed forward by the firing pin and may not get ignition every time.
 
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I think most of the velocity advantage of the 460 rowland is due to the increased chamber pressure. Although the 460R brass is longer than 45 ACP or 45 super brass there really isn't any increase in case capacity (at least not in the 1911 platform) because the OAL is limited by the magazine.

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Discussion Starter #16
I took a quick look at the 45 LC and 460 Rowland loads. The 45 LC seems pushes 225 gr bullet between 900 and 1100 fps. The 460 Rowland pushes a 230 gr bullet between 1100 and 1400 fps. I believe this is mostly due to case strength and the ability to use faster burning powders. Both great rounds mind you and I'm not throwing away my 45 LC. ;-)
 

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45 Colt is severely under loaded ammo due to the old guns such as Colt SAA. is you go to Buffalo Bore and check out their ammo you can see the potential of 45 Colt. And it has been shown that the brass is not the weak point for that round. It is definitely old guns that can't handle the pressure.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I did find a +P 45 LC load pushing a 260 gr bullet at 1900 fps. It says, "For modern Marlin, Winchester and Browning leverguns and Ruger and Freedom Arms revolvers only!"
I didn't know that a 45 LC could be pushed that fast.
45 Colt is severely under loaded ammo due to the old guns such as Colt SAA. is you go to Buffalo Bore and check out there ammo you can see the potential of 45 Colt. And it has been shown that the brass is not the weak point for that round. It is definitely old guns that can't handle the pressure.
 

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Bryan Alder is exactly right about the headspace. It sounds like an interesting project. I am looking forward to the next progress report.
 

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They can pushed the hardest in a Winchester model 92. Check out some of the posts Gaterskinner has with his Rossi 92 in 45 Colt.
 
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