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Go on You Tube and watch some of the gun videos. I never watched this stuff, didn’t even know it existed until grandkids put me on it. You can find half wits doing all kids of stuff. The blow up guns, shoot anything that fits down barrel and not to be outdone, shoot themselves in the leg. Then there is these idiots that have a series of videos on different guns and barely know how to load it. I hope newbies don’t take their advice. They ain’t experts and they should be in a “home”.
 

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I can just imagine how much of a pain it would be to get a 44-40 bullet stuck halfway up a rilf barrel cleared. I once had a squib on a 44mag and it went in about 2 inches into my pistol barrel and that was a real pain to get out without ruining my barrel. I ended up using a .400 diameter brass rod and penetrating oil to tap it out slowly.
 

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no.

no.

no.

ahh.......no.
 

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The whole concept of putting the .44-40 into the .444 Marlin is irresponsible, reckless, and just stupid. The author is an idiot who should know better and whoever allowed that article on their website leverguns.com is an even bigger idiot. You put cartridges in a firearm based on what is stamped on the barrel of that firearm. Don't do it. Don't even think about doing it. And to post the ballistics! Come to think of it, we are beyond moron and idiot and irresponsible with this one.
 

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The whole concept of putting the .44-40 into the .444 Marlin is irresponsible, reckless, and just stupid. The author is an idiot who should know better and whoever allowed that article on their website leverguns.com is an even bigger idiot.
The author of that article was the one and only Paco Kelly.
That name should ring a bell or two.
Paco Kelly also happens to be the owner of the website.

If you wish to express your views on the matter, in the name of saving the world from themselves, the appropriate contact information can be found here: website information Or here: Pacotools - Home


You put cartridges in a firearm based on what is stamped on the barrel of that firearm. Don't do it. Don't even think about doing it. And to post the ballistics! Come to think of it, we are beyond moron and idiot and irresponsible with this one.
Wait...
So, that makes it beyond moronic, idiotic, and irresponsible to shoot .38 Special in a .357 Mag?
.357 Mag in a .357 Max?
.32 S&W in a .32 S&W Long?
.32 S&W Long in a .32 H&R?
.32 H&R in a .327 Federal?
.32 S&W Long in a .327 Federal?
.44 Russian in a .44 Special?
.44 Special in a .44 Mag?
.44 Mag in a .445 Super Mag?
.44 Russian in a .44 Mag?
.44 Special in a .445 Super Mag?
.22 BB in a .22 Short?
.22 CB in a .22 BB?
.22 BB in a .22 CB?
.22 CB in a .22 Short?
.22 CB in a .22 LR?
.22 Short in a .22 LR?
.22 Long in a .22 LR?
.22 WRF in a .22 WMR?
.45 Colt in a .454 Casull?
.454 Casull in a .460 S&W?
.45 Colt in a .460 S&W?
.480 Ruger in a .475 Linebaugh?
.50 Special in a .500 S&W?
.30-30 in a .30-40 Krag?
.30-40 Krag in a .303 British?
.444 LVR in a .444 Marlin?

And, how about a short tidbit on one dear to my heart: .44-40 Shot shells, aka, ".44 Shot" in a .410 bore. We all know .410 bore today, but it didn't really come around until about 1910. It was introduced more than 30 years prior, but was dead in the water as a black powder cartridge. Before .410 bore came back around, one of the more common 'pest control' / 'garden gun' shot shells was .44-40 Shot. Although sometimes offered in smokeless form, it was generally only available as a black powder cartridge.

When smokeless powder became viable and popular, people wanted in on it with a small bore pest control shotgun. So, what is now the 'modern' .410 bore chamber was designed to fill that gap, while also allowing buyers of the new shotguns to use up their existing stocks of .44-40 Shot ammunition, or continue reloading and using the same .44-40 shells. This can be seen in early marketing and markings on the early 'transition years' .410s, as they are usually marked ".410 bore / .44 Shot".

Every .410 bore shotgun sold since 1910 has a chamber designed to also handle .44-40 Shot shells. Very, very few gun owners will ever have a shotgun so marked. But that doesn't make it unsafe. (I am lucky enough to have and shoot one of each, all 1913 or older: .44 Shot, .410/.44 Shot, and .410. I do not shoot .410 in the .44 Shot barrel. But I do shoot .44 Shot in all of them.)


Generalized statements are only as good as their foundation. And the foundation of "only shoot what is marked on the gun" has a lot of holes.
Is it a good starting point for people that don't know any better? Absolutely.
But it is not the only consideration.


Some of you may find it interesting to see that SAAMI doesn't bother to note a single dangerous ammunition combination for .444 Marlin ... even while listing some rather absurd things like .44 Mag in a .45 Auto.
https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Unsafe-Arms-and-Ammunition-Combinations-Web-Site-and-Brochure-Master-Revised-2-18-2019.pdf

Should you do it?
No. It's not worth it.
But even SAAMI doesn't think it's a bad enough idea to put any of the .44 caliber 'short' cartridges in the dangerous combinations list.
 

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When I wrote "You put cartridges in a firearm based on what is stamped on the barrel of that firearm." I knew that someone would cook up something about what I said and eventually come up with the .38 Special/.357 Magnum, etc. issue. There are accepted industry/SAAMI standards for cartridges and there is some degree of crossover (that is recognized by industry standards) typically based upon the length of the cartridge and the chamber into which it is inserted along with pressure considerations, etc. So the industry through SAAMI has stated that it is OK to put .38 Special in a firearm stamped .357 Magnum. I would say that most of us on this website are probably familiar with the details of those issues. Now because SAAMI hasn't specifically said "Don't put a .44 Remington magnum or .44-40 etc. in a .444 Marlin" doesn't mean much for the simple reason that neither you nor I nor SAAMI can possibly think of every possible thing someone who is creative can come up with to do something wrong. In this particular case with the .44/40 and .444 Marlin there are dimensional differences with the cartridges that might be significant when applied to a particular firearm. The bottom line is that portions of this article and the information in it were inappropriate and that should have been recognized by both the author and editor.
 

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I do not even shoot .38 special in my .357 magnums due to possible flame erosion of the the cylinder walls due to the shorter case, leading to difficulty when loading full length magnum cases.
may just be a silly theory but it possesses some logic of a possibility
 

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The bottom line is that portions of this article and the information in it were inappropriate and that should have been recognized by both the author and editor.
I provided contact information above.
The author, editor, and owner are all the same person.

Please do share your opinion with them, if you feel so strongly about the danger and inappropriateness of the concept.
 

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Late to this show, but can't resist noting that nobody (nice list, FM!) has mentioned the .40S&W in 10mm... I'll go to sleep now.:goodnight:
 

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Anyone that has read Paco Kelly's articles over the years knows that he pushes the envelope on most things he's into. He has written excellent article on the "dot" powders and also created modification tools for 22 rimfire ammunition. Not only does he shoot 44-40 out of the 444, he shoots 38-55 out of the 375. Would I do it? No. One of the reasons the 44-40 can be shot from a 444 is the case size on the 44-40 is larger then the 44 magnum. It is more akin to a 45 necked down to 44. It was not meant to be used as a substitute for the 444 round. More like a "Well, I'll be!!!!" thing. The 38-55 was because once the case was fireformed to the 375 chamber it could be reloaded as a 375 with more room for powder. Not for the beginner.
There are experienced reloaders that can do things like this and do. We seldom mention them on the internet with the people in this medium that do not know what they do not know. It comes under the heading of just because you can, does not mean it is a good idea. It is your gun and your life, If you choose to do these things fine. Just be careful with whom you share the information because sooner or later someone is going to think it is a "here, hold my bear" moment.
I can shoot 44 American, 44 Russian, and 44 special in my 44 magnum and I can shoot all those in a 445 magnum. Do I do it? Once in a while, but not as a regular thing. I have guns that shoot 44 specials and others that shoot 44 magnums. I have some cylinders that only get 44 American/44 Russian loads but I have enough guns that I seldom mix cartridges even when I can. If you are going to mix them, just be sure you get the information you need to do it without ruining a cylinder to the point it can only be used with the shortest cartridge. The reason most people have two cylinders for 45's is because of the 45 acp. They can shoot shorter 45 Colt brass and do the same thing. But a dedicated cylinder chambered for the cartridge give you the best possible results for that configuration.
I hope this clears up some of the questions you might have on these practices. The 444 is a wonderful rifle cartridge. It is not meant to be a 44 magnum or 44-40. There are rifles chambered for those cartridges. Do yourself a favor and learn to load for the rifle you have and forget the gimmicks. It will reward you in the end.
 

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How can a 38-55 case be "fireformed" to fit in a .375 chamber. The 38-55 is longer than the .375 Win. case. When I bought my Marlin .375 when they first came out I bought all of the .375 cases that I could find which was about 100. I used them for full power jacketed bullet loads because they were made for the higher pressure of that cartridge. For cast bullet loads that were a lot milder, I purchased some 38-55 cases and as common sense told me I used a case trimmer to cut them to the same length as the .375 cases. This has worked well for me and I still have the rifle .
 

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From what I understood from his article, you still use the .375 COL. The gain in powder capacity comes from firing the 38-55 case in your chamber and taking advantage of its thinner wall case for the extra case capacity. Usually measured by how much water the case will hold. I defer to him for the particulars. I shoot 444s.
 

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Late to this show, but can't resist noting that nobody (nice list, FM!) has mentioned the .40S&W in 10mm... I'll go to sleep now.
As a rule, I wouldn't shoot .40 S&W out of a 10mm firearm. The majority of handguns that are auto loaders, headspace on the case mouth of the cartridge. Now, since the .40 is shorter than the 10mm, this will cause excessive headspace, and subsequent failures, and catastrophies if shot.
Another thing, since the .40 is shorter than the 10mm, one might have erratic firing problems, because the firing pin may not be able to reach the primer.
Again, I wouldn't do such a thing. I have a bad habit of enjoying my digits and appendages exactly where they should be.
Only use the correct ammo for which your firearm states on the barrel or the slide of the firearm.
´Nuff said!

Hawk

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Another point to be considered....

The .44-40 ( aka .44 WCF ) has always been a bottleneck cartridge.
Shooting them out of a straight walled cartridge rifle like the .444 Marlin.
When the .44-40 is fired, it doesn't have any way sealing the chamber with expansion.
If you don´t have an explosion on your hands while doing, you will certainly have gasses and flames escaping around the .44-40 if it does seal at all. I´m betting the cartridge will over expand, and you may have a split case scenario at the least. At the most you can have a case mouth separation and have a brass ring left in the chamber.
One of the posters said this gentleman ( thinking of a different name other than ) has a lot of reloading experience?!? I´m at the thought of if this "experienced" reloader had dynamite for brains, he wouldn't have enough to blow his own nose.
While this gentleman may keep doing so, always keep in mind Murphy´s Law - Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong!
It´s not a matter of if, but when an explosion will destroy that wonderful .444, and maybe yourself in the process.
How do you go in front of God, and explain to the Almighty, well.....uh......I was stupid, and blew myself up.
This brings a movie quote from Jurassic Park, and Malcom that said, "They didn't stop at the idea of can I do this, but they really should have asked, should I do this?"


Hawk

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Using 38/55 brass in 375w for cast or light loads is a waste. A little more trouble but 30/30 cases blown out is cheaper way to go.
They fire form easy with 5-7 grains of fast burning powder and corn meal filler. I did same thing when I got a Marlin 375w. I got lucky and picked up 260 new brass and over 500 1x along with about 80 I had on hand makes a lifetime supply. I gave away 100 of the 30/30 I blew out and have 3 boxes loaded with 200gr cast.
 
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