Vintage 38-40 ammo questions

[dhansen]

Polyethylene Shot Buffer (this is a great thread!)

David

[smithywess]

Lou,
Just a word here. Relining to the original specs does not "alter" the gun from original - is not supposed to de-value in any way. altering the chamber will, though you can make the chamber match the barrel better, it will be out of spec. Your oversized barrel is original, but it isn't right, and altering the chamber to make it all work will "alter the rifle from original specs". However, as always, the choices belong to the owner. Dad flew in from San Diego, he's 85, and life got in the way, but I will get your package in the mail.

Jeff
NRA Life

Jeff,

Relining or reboring the barrel must surely devalue a rifle in the eyes of a collector should it have any collector value to start with. Both would be clearly visible to anyone with a casual interest in the rifle. The calibre, for instance is stamped on a barrel flat near the receiver. However I can't imagine how removing perhaps a thousandths of an inch from the chamber throat (neck if you wish) with a throating reamer could possibly affect it's collector value. It's not visible and how is anyone to know ?

[Sweetwater]

Jeff,

Relining or reboring the barrel must surely devalue a rifle in the eyes of a collector should it have any collector value to start with. Both would be clearly visible to anyone with a casual interest in the rifle. The calibre, for instance is stamped on a barrel flat near the receiver. However I can't imagine how removing perhaps a thousandths of an inch from the chamber throat (neck if you wish) with a throating reamer could possibly affect it's collector value. It's not visible and how is anyone to know ?

According to an appraiser, relining to original and maintaining all original barrel markings, would not drop the value of my lettered '73 Winchester 38WCF. We will not know, as it will never be sold - was my great-grandfather's from new. IF there are any real authorities here, I'd like to hear from them.
"how is anyone to know" - Someone would know that something was amiss when the standard cartridge comes out of the chamber all wallowed out of spec. I'd know as soon as it hit the sizing die, and I'd be a bit upset.

Jeff
NRA Life

[30wcf]

Lou,
Thank you for the link. Nice to know that they offer the 20/1 lead/tin bullets.

Sweetwater,
It appears that, in some cases, not only were bores oversized, the chamber or portions thereof were oversized as well from the factory. My 1873 Winchester .44 W.C.F. made in 1882 is one example. A fired case will accept a .437" diameter bullet.

w30wcf

[lever addict]

I bought a sample pack of the .403's. I will test them with and without the PSB. I still don't know if I can use Unique and PSB? Do I need a powder that fills the case a certain amount? Do I cut back 1 grain of powder and make it up with the PSB? Does it have to be compressed so it doesn't move from the base of the bullet?

[Sweetwater]

Lou,
I use in the area of 7 gr with Unique or Green Dot and no filler in my 38WCF. No problems with that load and it runs about 1100fps.

Jeff
NRA Life

[smithywess]

I bought a sample pack of the .403's. I will test them with and without the PSB. I still don't know if I can use Unique and PSB? Do I need a powder that fills the case a certain amount? Do I cut back 1 grain of powder and make it up with the PSB? Does it have to be compressed so it doesn't move from the base of the bullet?

Lou,

Unique is a funny powder. Very useful but funny all the same. Sometimes there's some really curious pressure spikes without any particular gain in velocity. I think Larry Gibson is correct when he advises against the use of fillers with powders that burn at a rate faster than 4227. Unique is one them. I don't use a filler with that powder, and as time passes I try to even avoid it because I think it's position sensitive as well as being a little unpredictable with the pressures. I.M.R.or Hodgon 4227 work well. Weigh the P.S.B. when you put it in the case overtop of the powder so you can keep things equal for each round. I use one of these Lee scoops and it's amazing how fast you can go when things are rolling well. Fill the case to half way up the neck so that the bullet will compress the P.S.B. down onto the powder. Don't leave an air gap. The filler will raise your pressure so cut back your initial load 10% and work back up carefully from there. If you use 4227 in the .38-40 with a 180 grain flat base bullet you'll get about a 50% case fill capacity. Perhaps a little more but not much.

Thanks.

[lever addict]

I have some H-4198. Any idea with it and the 38-40? It works well in my 38-55 and 32-40!

[Sweetwater]

IF you are going to use the slower powders, be careful of vintage of your rifle. They are not recommended for the black powder rifles; but I would like to hear from some of you with rifles from the 1880's using them in the 38WCF and the 44WCF - just from the experience point of knowledge.

Jeff
NRA Life

[smithywess]

I have some H-4198. Any idea with it and the 38-40? It works well in my 38-55 and 32-40!

Lou,

I couldn't find any loads using 4198 in the .38-40 but 2400 and 4227 are both listed as being good by Ken Watters as well as the old Lyman manuals. I've had good luck with 4227.

Thanks.